Another big loss

[jardi]

Afternoon Fatfan, jeez you get yourself wound up sir. Let me assure you that suggesting to a fellow poster ( "best not to contribute," )when his contribution was to add several more salaries to a yearly loss of 220k and 660k over 3 years is not arrogant in any way, it is simple fiscal common sense, and I'm sure the poster would agree.
Please be assured that when posting on line, it is impossible to include all the inferences that one would consider if talking face to face, but 100% I would state that it would be crazy to pour fuel on a raging blaze by adding yet more salaries to our very scary loss.

In summary at QOS, we have a tired BOD who would rather pass over the reins, but there are no willing investors, so they are soldiering on, shoring up the club finances, as costs spiral out of control, due to a raft of reasons, including the minimum wage, and they simply cannot carry on with things as they are and something will have to 'give'.

Personally, I would like to see an increase of personnel onto the Board, and some sort of sensible fan representation, so we can have a vibrant, forward thinking BOD who will tackle the basics and get the fans on side again, like what is happening in Annan.

Unfortunately, there is no alternative but to rely on fans to do some of the jobs that need doing at Palmerston, that is just a simple fact.

Whatever has happened in the past needs a line drawn under it, and for everyone to work for the greater good, - -not for what one can get out of it.

No doubt, I will have upset some people on here and the BOD with these remarks, and let me aplogise in advance if I have offended anyone, but QOS FC is like the NHS, - it needs radical reform, but until we sit round the table and admit that very difficult decisions and changes will have to be made, then we will continue to make annual losses of £200k until the plug is pulled for good.

So that in a nutshell, is my interpretation of what is going on, or not going on, and pointing the finger at the BOD and expecting them to do more, when they are doing much, much more than anyone has the remotest idea of, is grossly unfair.

If we want the club to survive, then moaning about helping out with some menial tasks is not the best way of going about it.

Sorry for any offence.

[Threefivetwo]

Jardi, without knowing the inner working of the mind of fatfan, I dont think he's getting wound up. Potentially wondering why someone's getting shot down in flames for opening ot suggesting something when, I all honesty, it can be seen as no more 'out there' than approaching a multi millionaire (with no interest in football) with a metaphorical begging bowl similar to a doonhame Oliver Twist.

I have family members who are still in school who have never had a QoS rep or player visit said establishments to drum up support or build rapport with the local townspeople, particularly youngsters who are and/or will be the life blood of the club going forward. I may be wrong, and the 5 schools (large ones at that) that I'm aware of might simply have been missed, but I think this would be a great start. I was a youngster a long time ago, but this would have thrilled me no end.

[Threefivetwo]

**opining at**
Predictive text......

[Threefivetwo]

Lastly from me on that particular subject. You will have far greater business acumen than I ever will however, surely making the ground and its surroundings more enticing will potentially attract at least some fans. Yes, yes, I'm fully aware the product on the park is awful but everything rolls into the other.

Obviously any team moving to a shiny new ground adds to the crowd immediately. Clearly its no exclusively down to that but it has some part to play

[fatfan]

QUOTE=jardi;40447121]Afternoon Fatfan, jeez you get yourself wound up sir. Let me assure you that suggesting to a fellow poster ( "best not to contribute," )when his contribution was to add several more salaries to a yearly loss of 220k and 660k over 3 years is not arrogant in any way, it is simple fiscal common sense, and I'm sure the poster would agree.
Please be assured that when posting on line, it is impossible to include all the inferences that one would consider if talking face to face, but 100% I would state that it would be crazy to pour fuel on a raging blaze by adding yet more salaries to our very scary loss.

In summary at QOS, we have a tired BOD who would rather pass over the reins, but there are no willing investors, so they are soldiering on, shoring up the club finances, as costs spiral out of control, due to a raft of reasons, including the minimum wage, and they simply cannot carry on with things as they are and something will have to 'give'.

Personally, I would like to see an increase of personnel onto the Board, and some sort of sensible fan representation, so we can have a vibrant, forward thinking BOD who will tackle the basics and get the fans on side again, like what is happening in Annan.

Unfortunately, there is no alternative but to rely on fans to do some of the jobs that need doing at Palmerston, that is just a simple fact.

Whatever has happened in the past needs a line drawn under it, and for everyone to work for the greater good, - -not for what one can get out of it.

No doubt, I will have upset some people on here and the BOD with these remarks, and let me aplogise in advance if I have offended anyone, but QOS FC is like the NHS, - it needs radical reform, but until we sit round the table and admit that very difficult decisions and changes will have to be made, then we will continue to make annual losses of £200k until the plug is pulled for good.

So that in a nutshell, is my interpretation of what is going on, or not going on, and pointing the finger at the BOD and expecting them to do more, when they are doing much, much more than anyone has the remotest idea of, is grossly unfair.

If we want the club to survive, then moaning about helping out with some menial tasks is not the best way of going about it.

Sorry for any offence.[/QUOTE]

Jardi let me reassure you I am far from wound up. What I don’t like seeing is people being told not to post something no matter if you are in agreement or not. It would have been far better stating your point rather than telling someone not to bother posting because you don’t agree. How the hell are we supposed to start debates when people are told that, but enough said on that as I think you see my point.
I actually agree with a few of your points but tell me this as I might be way off the mark here.

The club employ a full time groundsman if I am not mistaken. At this time he has no pitch to look after for obvious reasons. I know he cleans changing rooms etc but that’s hardly a full time job. So how much would it cost for a bod to point things out like cleaning seats or picking up leaves. Or even having someone come in and fix a few taps in the toilets so you can wash your hands after being to the toilet, particularly when a chairman has a building company with people who can sort that issue out in a heartbeat at very little cost to the club.

How much would it cost for the club to get the pipe band to come in at ht and do a turn, maybe a donation.

How much would it cost to get first team players to attend some of the initiatives on the go that Dan runs. Zero as it should be in contracts

Jesus how much would it cost to send a Xmas message to the supporters. Something as simple as that.

It’s not all about money. It’s about devoting yourself to the club that you own/in charge of and bringing some pride to the town in a football sense and tbh this current board just are nowhere near that. They are so far disconnected from the support some wouldn’t know who they were.

I fully agree that there should be more board members and some form of fan representation but that has been tried and the current bod failed to work with the liaison lads.
And bearing in mind it was not that long ago that the very same chairman was telling all that he was ready to build a new stand for the club with other businesses working out of rented offices.

So I will ask you this jardi. Apart from loyalty, what else attracts you to Palmerston every Saturday because for me it’s like smoking. A bad habit that I will struggle to stop. I know it’s bad for me but through habit I keep going. Not because I enjoy it!!

[jardi]

Threefivetwo, - I'm totally with you, - and I'm totally with Fatfan too, - believe it or not, - its just not possible to square the circle and attend to all your 'asks'.

Let's be clear: if we didn't have a £220k year on year loss, - then I too would be saying we need to speculate to accumulate in terms of titivating the ground, - but at this rate we are heading for oblivion, - its like painting the Titanic while its sinking.

So, - what I'm suggesting is that we should ask the BOD to concentrate on saving the club, - while we, - the supporters lend a hand to do some of the simple things to make the ground look a bit more presentable.

What I would like to see too though, - is some of the youth team members doing their bit to tidy the place up, - having a pride in their club, but maybe that's asking too much?

Please tell me if Ian Wright and I are barking up the wrong tree? Clearly, I come from a very old fashioned background, where 'mucking in' and doing your bit was expected, - rather like living on an island and doing several different jobs, - hence why I have a polarised view on this.

[jardi]

Obviously our posts coincided. I agree with everything you say Fatfan, - apart from the completely nonsensical suggestion to add fuel to the fire and take on more salaries.....no, no, and no, it is completely suicidal. What is worse though, - is that you keep on beating the same drum, - wanting and expecting more when the club is in serious financial trouble.

A loss of £220K in one year is terrifying, but to keep on making that loss year on year should be making every supporter wake up and think, - "if things don't change, - we will have no club."

Anyway, - that's my last word on the topic.

[fatfan]

Obviously our posts coincided. I agree with everything you say Fatfan, - apart from the completely nonsensical suggestion to add fuel to the fire and take on more salaries.....no, no, and no, it is completely suicidal. What is worse though, - is that you keep on beating the same drum, - wanting and expecting more when the club is in serious financial trouble.

A loss of £220K in one year is terrifying, but to keep on making that loss year on year should be making every supporter wake up and think, - "if things don't change, - we will have no club."

Anyway, - that's my last word on the topic.

Jardi you have either misread my post or choosing to twist it a bit. At no point did I say Emily another groundsman. Quite the opposite. What I’m saying is get the groundsman to do his job. That would be a start. And yes I am in full agreement that supporters can do their bit, but that should be above what is expected.

The things I have mentioned are basics. They won’t attract supporters to the club, not by any means. But when you can’t wash your hands after having a pee or sitting on top of bird s??t, that’s just not acceptable. No matter what standard of football you are playing.

Getting first team players to promote the club and attract supporters back and get a relationship with supporters costs nothing

You say the board are doing there utmost with the club, so tell the supporters what they are doing.

These are simple things which they refuse to do so no way am I happy with the club.

And I hasten to add that your good self has failed to answer the simple question of what is appealing about going to Palmerston at this time

[jardi]

"It would have been far better stating your point rather than telling someone not to bother posting because you don’t agree. How the hell are we supposed to start debates when people are told that, but enough said on that as I think you see my point."

Fatfan, - point taken. Obviously, - it wasn't meant in that vain, - but has come across as that. Hand's up.

Having taken the time to properly read your post, (as our posts crossed) - the above line stood out, - and you are quite right.

As mentioned earlier, - the problem with posting like this, - is that it becomes one dimensional, whereas, - if we were sitting in a cafe or bar, - or standing on the terracing, - you could quickly say "I didn't mean that.......I meant this"

Not wishing to labour the point though, - we are in serious trouble, - and that should be at the forefront of all our minds.

[jardi]

Fatfan, - I'm on two computers at the moment and juggling several tasks; in essence I accept what you and others are saying, - absolutely, - and in no other business would it be acceptable to pay £18.00 to sit on a dirty seat, - or not be able to wash your hands in the toilet, - these are basics that have been left to wither on the vine, - I think after a vandal attack.

However, - these 'minor' issues pale into insignificance when we look at the bigger picture, - and what we all need to do (I think) is park our grievances and see what is best for the club we love. I earlier used the analogy of the NHS, - which is clearly not fit for the 21st century, - and neither is Palmerston, - or a good part of the club, - and what is required is an honest, realistic debate about how we move forward.

However, - I'm not sure that we are ready for that.

It's like closing churches or clubs, - or on a bigger scale finding a solution for Palestine, or Ukraine/ Russia - there will always be entrenched views and those with axes to grind.