Russian Concert Hall

[regis80]

Did anyone watch that interview between US conservative Tucker Carlson and Putin? In that interview its claimed Bojo sabotaged a deal that would have ended the conflict and all would have been resolved. Surely this isn’t anything like Bojo?

Anyway, in that interview Putin claims US blew up nordstream. War is big money as you know. I don’t believe a thing we are always spoon fed with.

It’s probably why there’s such a media rejection to Trump, and I think when Starmer gets in, this will be our biggest regret. I won’t be voting.

[boingy]

😭😭😭 - Furlong for England 😂😂😂

Why not? Top player. One of our full backs v Brazil was absolutely woeful the other day. Chilwell. Awful. Furlong would have been much better.

[Leicesterbaggie]

What a surprise! I think most individuals would have predicted that Putin would link the concert hall attack to Ukraine. Anybody who believes him needs their heads examined. Surely the last place that they would make for would be Ukraine, an area teeming with Russian soldiers. Does this man think that the rest of the world is that gullible? I, personally, don’t believe one word that is uttered from this man’s lips. A despicable individual!

[Omegstrat6]

As liquidator quite rightly alluded to, there are very few -if any?- countries that have not acted shamefully in the past and, regrettably, some continue to do so. Despite it's post war anti-colonial stance the US was certainly no paragon of virtue during the Cold War and employed various dirty tricks to influence regimes in other countries for many years (and to think Kissenger still got a Nobel Prize! )but if we are to talk about regimes now, surely there is little comparison between the vast majority of Western democratic countries today and the autocratic regimes of, say, Russia, China, Iran or North Korea.

There are no two ways about it, Western actions in the Middle East for example were never all squeaky clean nor arguably justified but I think there is a world of difference between the ethos of say the US or UK and the Russian Federation under Putin when it comes to warfare. Putin is very clearly deliberately attacking civilian infrastructure in Ukraine and cares little for civilian lives but this is the same playbook he used in Chechnya and Syria so should not be any real surprise. Did the US kill innocent civilians during its war in Iraq? Certainly. Were some individuals amongst Coalition forces -including some from the UK- guilty of war crimes during the War on Terror? Undoubtedly-but it was not official policy and was not condoned so I do not think you can compare the two. Russia, after all, used mercenaries and regiments made up of convicts (including rapists and murderers) when launching its attack on Ukraine which surely says something.

[baggieal]

No

As liquidator quite rightly alluded to, there are very few -if any?- countries that have not acted shamefully in the past and, regrettably, some continue to do so. Despite it's post war anti-colonial stance the US was certainly no paragon of virtue during the Cold War and employed various dirty tricks to influence regimes in other countries for many years (and to think Kissenger still got a Nobel Prize! )but if we are to talk about regimes now, surely there is little comparison between the vast majority of Western democratic countries today and the autocratic regimes of, say, Russia, China, Iran or North Korea.

There are no two ways about it, Western actions in the Middle East for example were never all squeaky clean nor arguably justified but I think there is a world of difference between the ethos of say the US or UK and the Russian Federation under Putin when it comes to warfare. Putin is very clearly deliberately attacking civilian infrastructure in Ukraine and cares little for civilian lives but this is the same playbook he used in Chechnya and Syria so should not be any real surprise. Did the US kill innocent civilians during its war in Iraq? Certainly. Were some individuals amongst Coalition forces -including some from the UK- guilty of war crimes during the War on Terror? Undoubtedly-but it was not official policy and was not condoned so I do not think you can compare the two. Russia, after all, used mercenaries and regiments made up of convicts (including rapists and murderers) when launching its attack on Ukraine which surely says something.

Here here to a balanced and educated post!

[mickd1961]

As liquidator quite rightly alluded to, there are very few -if any?- countries that have not acted shamefully in the past and, regrettably, some continue to do so. Despite it's post war anti-colonial stance the US was certainly no paragon of virtue during the Cold War and employed various dirty tricks to influence regimes in other countries for many years (and to think Kissenger still got a Nobel Prize! )but if we are to talk about regimes now, surely there is little comparison between the vast majority of Western democratic countries today and the autocratic regimes of, say, Russia, China, Iran or North Korea.

There are no two ways about it, Western actions in the Middle East for example were never all squeaky clean nor arguably justified but I think there is a world of difference between the ethos of say the US or UK and the Russian Federation under Putin when it comes to warfare. Putin is very clearly deliberately attacking civilian infrastructure in Ukraine and cares little for civilian lives but this is the same playbook he used in Chechnya and Syria so should not be any real surprise. Did the US kill innocent civilians during its war in Iraq? Certainly. Were some individuals amongst Coalition forces -including some from the UK- guilty of war crimes during the War on Terror? Undoubtedly-but it was not official policy and was not condoned so I do not think you can compare the two. Russia, after all, used mercenaries and regiments made up of convicts (including rapists and murderers) when launching its attack on Ukraine which surely says something.

As always Omeg you make a very skilled and incisive argument, I take my hat off to your incredible knowledge and detail in these matters, you are way more intelligent than me on these sorts of matters.

Ultimately, I’m not sure there’s anything much we can do other than keep trying to help the Ukraine as best we can.

I was reading a very sobering piece yesterday about Russia’s capabilities to wreak death and destruction upon us from afar should they so wish.

Apparently, they have a missile called the Satan ll which they could deploy. This missile gets fired into the sea some distance from the UK shoreline and creates a tsunami type radioactive wave 1600 feet high that swaps the U.K. and turns it into a radioactive wasteland.

I feel like we’re playing checkers whilst Russia and others are playing Grand Master chess.

Our best hope is for Putin’s death and a more reasonable psychopath taking over.

[regis80]

Anyone seen the video of these scum bag terrorists caught facing trial? They thought they’d get away and now face hell. Looks like they’ve taken a beating already. If only all terrorist faced the same fate of what’s coming their way.

[Leicesterbaggie]

Can’t disagree with any of your observations Omegstrat. I realise that each nation tends to believe the narrative that their media presents but in democratic countries individuals are allowed to express opposing opinions without the fear of reprisals. In countries like Russia this is not the case and the public are presented with distortions of the truth and therefore, in the majority of cases, believe what they are told. An example of this is that they were not informed that Russia was warned by the US of the strong possibility of an attack such as the one that they experienced. If they had been, surely the public would question why Putin didn’t take note of said warning. They are basically kept in the dark and are only told what Putin wants them to hear.

As a country, we are far from perfect but I know where I would prefer to reside, Sadly, the Russian people live in a world according to Putin.

[Omegstrat6]

As always Omeg you make a very skilled and incisive argument, I take my hat off to your incredible knowledge and detail in these matters, you are way more intelligent than me on these sorts of matters.

Ultimately, I’m not sure there’s anything much we can do other than keep trying to help the Ukraine as best we can.

I was reading a very sobering piece yesterday about Russia’s capabilities to wreak death and destruction upon us from afar should they so wish.

Apparently, they have a missile called the Satan ll which they could deploy. This missile gets fired into the sea some distance from the UK shoreline and creates a tsunami type radioactive wave 1600 feet high that swaps the U.K. and turns it into a radioactive wasteland.

I feel like we’re playing checkers whilst Russia and others are playing Grand Master chess.

Our best hope is for Putin’s death and a more reasonable psychopath taking over.

Mick, I appreciate the compliment from both yourself and baggieal but am most certainly not more intelligent than anyone else on here! 😂

Everyone brings something to the table and has their own opinions on things based on their own reading, knowledge and experiences and everyone has their own particular areas of expertise. Everyone's point of view should be valued and If differing views provokes debate and even a re-examination of our own beliefs all the better! It's surely all about trying to gain a better understanding of whatever subject (Albion or otherwise!&#128512 is being discussed.

I personally have a very keen interest in history and try and read quite widely around stuff but I'm fully aware that I may be both ignorant of some aspects and that sources themselves can be wrong or open to different interpretation. The "when" and "wheres" of history might be collaborated but the "whys" and "hows" far harder to know. Think it was Churchill who said that history is written by the victor and so certain events/actions are highlighted where others are either not mentioned at all or else played down. It's not even always deliberate as original source memories can be fallible as the (then) 3 remaining Beatles demonstrated during their Anthology programme when each frequently remembered the same events slightly differently.

The truth is out there but, like Regis says, it seems we've got to look harder for it now beneath the surface stories of what we are being told. Guess this was always true to a degree but seems even more the case these days with Trump-ian "fake news", the rabbit hole dangers of internet spread conspiracy theories and worrying advances in AI.

As for this particular post, don't think I was really disagreeing with a lot of what had already been said by other posters whether yourself, baggieal or boingy.

As for Trump, I'm in agreement with you in that, regardless of all the other things I dislike about him, his increasingly Isolationist stance will certainly not benefit others- and not just NATO or Ukraine. His talk on raising tariffs to protect American companies and goods, for example, does not bode well for any anticipated favourable trade agreement with the US for ourselves-though even right wing Republicans are saying he is going too far and that such policies will only damage American interests.

And, yes, your last sentence-the sooner the better!!

[Omegstrat6]

Can’t disagree with any of your observations Omegstrat. I realise that each nation tends to believe the narrative that their media presents but in democratic countries individuals are allowed to express opposing opinions without the fear of reprisals. In countries like Russia this is not the case and the public are presented with distortions of the truth and therefore, in the majority of cases, believe what they are told. An example of this is that they were not informed that Russia was warned by the US of the strong possibility of an attack such as the one that they experienced. If they had been, surely the public would question why Putin didn’t take note of said warning. They are basically kept in the dark and are only told what Putin wants them to hear.

As a country, we are far from perfect but I know where I would prefer to reside, Sadly, the Russian people live in a world according to Putin.

That's the real worry isn't it Leics? Not only has Putin clamped down so effectively on those who might challenge his views, but it also appears to be the case that the vast majority of the Russian population-especially those living in the poorer rural regions- do not even question his propaganda. These may swallow his lies about the recent IS terrorist attack being underwritten by Ukraine and so support his further escalation of the war there.

Putin's continued control means that the situation in the country is very different from what it was in the late 80s when losses and failures in Afghanistan led popular opinion to force the Russian government to withdraw. Any hopes of internal pressures forcing him out seem very remote.

Certainly cannot condone such heinous terrorist acts against innocent civilians but Putin's own actions in Chechyna and Syria likely led to this and I don't think too many would lose much sleep if this same group managed to successfully target Putin himself. A failed Russian state benefits no-one but Putin is undoubtedly a threat to ourselves and not just Eastern Europe.