O/T - general election 2019

[Silly-miller]

Not half as stupid as certain posters on here.

I come on here and feel like chucking the feckin lap top thru the window with the crap some people post on here.

Get me a stiff drink somebody..

Ever thought of seeing a shrink about that anger of yours?

I get that you have Labour duvet covers, towels, curtains and underwear but not everyone is a vote labour or commit suicide some people are open minded to change roly mate

Btw I don’t mean this as a insult just pointing out not everyone is as passionate about labour as you especially with the crap that’s gone on, they aren’t better they are just wearing red instead of blue.

And this is for Tory die hards you think Tory’s are saving you money? Give over there are always consequences to cuts. Cuts to benefit = more people on street and that leads to poor hygiene to them and to passers by which is a burden to nhs which gov pays for and those who turn to crime instead of streets needs more police and more prison staff. The increase in crime poor hygiene is because of Tory’s and let’s face it nothing will change because you have to be lower than someone claiming benefits when they shouldn’t to be a politician. Yeah my opinion of them is that low.

[ragingpup]

Corporate tax rates are just one of a range of taxes and expenses that companies operating in the UK face. As Howdy has mentioned, business rate are another form of taxation. In addition land prices, wage rates and energy costs will be different from those in the countries that are competing to host the companies that operate, employ people and pay taxes in the UK.

The point is one of equilibrium; one can assume that the companies who operate, employ and pay taxes in the UK are the ones that consider the conditions in the UK to favour doing so. If you increase corporate tax rates, extend worker’s rights (which, before you go all morally superior, I am not necessary opposed to) and unleash the Trade Unions to cause mayhem of a type last seen in the 80s you shift that equilibrium by making the UK a less desirable place to do so. I assume that you can agree that? If you can’t, perhaps you can explain why?

As for Ireland having a corporate tax rate of just 12.5%, you will recall that I recently posted a link to an article that reported that Ireland had the 4th best standard of living in the world. Your response was that there was nothing within the article that indicated that low tax rates had increased tax revenues (by encouraging companies to choose to pay their taxes there). I found that quite revealing and confirmative of my suspicion that increased taxation rates is an article of faith for the current Labour membership as opposed to a means to an end.


Again, I think the notion that this site has a pro-conservative majority is an example of paranoia. Roly is still reeling over the claim not to be a Socialist that you made last week.

I think, if I remember rightly, the article you linked to stated that it couldn't say that the corporation tax was responsible for the alleged living standard. And that's assuming that you actually accept the criteria that Ireland has the 4th best living standards. Are you willing to accept that based on that one article? Why are you so willing to believe it? You normally have quite well tuned critical guard.

However, I've looked into it more and I will accept that there has been an increase in Corp tax receipts in the last two years. But you have to bear in mind that Ireland has quite particular circumstances and are propped up with relatively few (about 10)huge multinationals using Island as a low tax haven, leading to a huge relience on these large companies for keeping the economy ticking. They are quite vulnerable and not sure this would work for us.

It does support the case for looking very carefully at corporation tax and similar taxes that businesses pay and weighing up the balance without dogma. I've looked at lots of economist reports today on how Corp and business taxes work, the pros and cons and I can't find one that presents convincing evidence that UK corporation tax cuts will at least pay for themselves with increased revenue for the public purse. For everyone you find that argues it will, you find one that doesn't. And we've been cutting this tax for years, you'd think there would be the same kind of positive impact on the public kitty that we seem to have seen in Ireland. But I am convinced that Labour equally should not be dogmatic and follow an evidence based approach.

[rolymiller]

Not really Kerr. I can tolerate anyone who is centre/ left of centre on here.And as Pup said a lot of the Green party's policies are arguably more left than Labours. Blummin heck I even find myself agreeing with you at times partuicularly on issues of race but then you let yourself down by not challenging some of the views of people like gfire. You challenge my political views but not his for some reason and yet you don't appear to agree with him.You are a contrary Mary if I may say so!

[ragingpup]

1 or 2p on income tax wouldn't make a dent. That's the issue that politicians don't like to talk about.

Its a double pronged problem. Firstly that previous elections where a party has proposed that we all pay a penny more to fund services has tended not to be elected. Plus, as you say, even this penny or two wouldn't really cut it in solving the problem.

So what to do? We can ask the public if they're willing to fund it and take their answer on electing the party that doesn't offer to do this as a reason to do nothing and keep services underfunded.

Our we could ask if people democratically favour a progressive tax system where people that can afford it pay more than the present amount and enough to make a significant difference in creating the kind of towns we'd really like to live in. If we accept this as a democratic decision to actually do something different, instead of always getting more of the same, then the question is just how many do we collectively feel aye in scope? 80k 100k?etc. And how much?

I completely accept that this means that it is the majority are asking the minority to pay for improvement. Its not ideal and I wish that the majority could be pursuaded to elect a party where they also chose to pay a little more themselves. Most of us would be happy to do so but then wimp out somehow in the polling booth as you've said. But not sure we should abandon increased progressive taxation just because of this, simply as I don't see any other way of raising money, and that's for the tories spending plans as well as labour's.

[great_fire]

Not half as stupid as certain posters on here.

I come on here and feel like chucking the feckin lap top thru the window with the crap some people post on here.

Get me a stiff drink somebody..

So since Corbyn is planning to turn the NHS into the World Health Service please explain how he's going to pay for it.

[great_fire]

Not really Kerr. I can tolerate anyone who is centre/ left of centre on here.And as Pup said a lot of the Green party's policies are arguably more left than Labours. Blummin heck I even find myself agreeing with you at times partuicularly on issues of race but then you let yourself down by not challenging some of the views of people like gfire. You challenge my political views but not his for some reason and yet you don't appear to agree with him.You are a contrary Mary if I may say so!

He's a neoliberal/ Blairite/ Notting Hill Tory.

[rolymiller]

We can agree on that gfire. Good summing up...

[ragingpup]

Whether you are happy to learn from the imposition of a centrally imposed candidates in Rother Valley is irrelevant, It is the party that you represent and campaign for that needs to do so. Rother Valley is just one of many constituencies where it will happen. Similarly it is irrelevant if you think that your party should have room for centre ground, if your party doesn’t.

Simply don't agree with this. We have lots of centre ground voices. My mp Wes Streeting has always been quite anti Corbyn and is still fighting for labour. There are lots like Wes. All are welcome to put their opinions in. I have lots of disagreements with Wes but on most points we agree, as do most in the Labour cause. However, some disagree with Labour on some aspects that they choose to leave. That's their right. But to say that the party doesn't welcome and respect more centrist opinions isn't right. Although I do agree that there are some scumbags in some branches that express hostility. We have extremists but they are an unwelcome minority in my experience of meeting ya couple of hundred people in our constituency, and they get shouted down heartily.

[ragingpup]

He's a neoliberal/ Blairite/ Notting Hill Tory.

Interesting stay noticed today for fire and Roly. I think Labour have committed 4% rise to the NHS, just about what the NHS say is needed to provide what they need. The tories are busting a gut at committing to raise 3.4%.Blair and brown spent 6% a year to the NHS so they weren't all bad!

[animallittle3]

Interesting article about the party of fiscal responsibility .


https://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/...national-debt/