OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[ramAnag]

Perhaps it would be better to look at the manifestation of Brexit in terms of the Northern Ireland implications or the ridiculous stand off in the waters off Jersey earlier today.

Very good point, but as I see it, both seperate.
I blame the EU for putting the pressure on Ireland and using North and South as a tool.
Jersey has the right to control it's own fishing system and France is the one doing the bullying. The EU is conspicuous in its absense, with a member states actions.

I didn’t say they weren’t separate...obviously they are. What they have in common however is that they are both byproducts of Brexit.
There are, imo, a great many Brexit related issues that have been disguised by attention understandably given to the Covid crisis.
Northern Ireland is one, fishing is another...others may well relate to our international travel freedoms and conveniences, the extra expense involved in posting items to Europe, the problems involved in attracting apparently much needed temporary migrant labour from Europe etc. All things which were, at best, glossed over or denied by the Remain campaign.

[Trickytreesreds]

I didn’t say they weren’t separate...obviously they are. What they have in common however is that they are both byproducts of Brexit.
There are, imo, a great many Brexit related issues that have been disguised by attention understandably given to the Covid crisis.
Northern Ireland is one, fishing is another...others may well relate to our international travel freedoms and conveniences, the extra expense involved in posting items to Europe, the problems involved in attracting apparently much needed temporary migrant labour from Europe etc. All things which were, at best, glossed over or denied by the Remain campaign.

RA my point was, if common ground and co operation is needed for good sense. One side is doing it's level best to be as awkward as possible.
You may have the opinion that Brexit is n't worth this hassle, but I have the opinion that it reinforces why I wanted to leave.
The smiles soon fade way when you take away another childs toys.

Saw this little comment earlier.
Don't know which station it was on, but it sums up the French attitude of getting their own way, perfectly.

Just heard on the radio from a spokesman for the Jersey Fishing Industry, that not one Jersey boat has been granted a license to fish in French waters since Brexit. Though they were told if they provided the documented evidence they fished in French waters before, they would be granted licenses.
They provided the evidence within 3/4 days and EVERY SINGLE ONE WAS REFUSED ! Yet the French are screaming that they either didn't know about the documented evidence to be able to fish in Jersey waters, or they haven't been given enough time and they had 4 MONTHS !!

PS, migrant labour will be accepted where needed. The right to upsticks and come willy nilly, has ended.
They need to apply, seeing as we are struggling without the EU.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57008220

[ramAnag]

RA my point was, if common ground and co operation is needed for good sense. One side is doing it's level best to be as awkward as possible.
You may have the opinion that Brexit is n't worth this hassle, but I have the opinion that it reinforces why I wanted to leave.
The smiles soon fade way when you take away another childs toys.

Saw this little comment earlier.
Don't know which station it was on, but it sums up the French attitude of getting their own way, perfectly.

Just heard on the radio from a spokesman for the Jersey Fishing Industry, that not one Jersey boat has been granted a license to fish in French waters since Brexit. Though they were told if they provided the documented evidence they fished in French waters before, they would be granted licenses.
They provided the evidence within 3/4 days and EVERY SINGLE ONE WAS REFUSED ! Yet the French are screaming that they either didn't know about the documented evidence to be able to fish in Jersey waters, or they haven't been given enough time and they had 4 MONTHS !!

PS, migrant labour will be accepted where needed. The right to upsticks and come willy nilly, has ended.
They need to apply, seeing as we are struggling without the EU.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57008220

I’m not actually defending the French attitude, Tricky...I don’t know enough about the ins and outs and I’m aware of areas of the British media who are, ridiculously, trying to blow all this ‘gun boat diplomacy’ into a second Falklands scenario.

Some will doubtless swallow it and see another opportunity for a rendition of ‘Britain Rules the Waves’...it’s rubbish imo...we’d be much better off being on good terms with our geographical neighbours and allies...as we were before the unnecessary jingoism of Brexit.

Don’t expect you to agree...Brexit is one of a number of issues which we will always disagree over.

[swaledale]

I did. It is. QED you are

Its also the end of my contribution to this little cul de sac. The original query was from rA, and despite my inability to either explain things clearly enough or convince him of my stance, our conversation has remained cordial, with an attempt at constructive responses going both ways. I won't speak for rA, but from my side, when he makes a point in such a manner, it makes me think about 'things', including whether I'm right. Your venting, I'm afraid, only makes me think about what your life problems are (seriously), so by all means vent away but don't expect a response. Your tasteless 'look what I've got fellahs' rant from a few days ago, which you haven't yet had the good grace to apologise for, tells us all what sort of person you are, and that's not the sort of person I take much notice of anyway - In 'real life' you are the pub bore, eventually left ranting to the poor barman alone as the other 'regulars' find another pub. I guess that's what's happening here

Oh f@ck off you odious stupid little man, childishly repeating something that is obviously incorrect I mean explain how a Uk white citizen can make a racist remark about other white Uk citizens? Its obviously not racist, but as i observed before, stating that white is black when it clearly isn't does not mean its black, it just means the person who said that is stupid.

I thought even you would be capable of understanding the english language but clearly not.

Venting? of course I vent when confronted with an covert xenophobe and racist like you, who hides behind a mask of respectability whilst clearly being a narrow minded little Englander who hasn't a ****ing clue what he is talking about.

As for reasonable argument making you think? What a liar you are! You don't respond to reasonable argument, you don't even acknowledge when your utterly wrong, you nit pick little details and sneer, ignoring the main argument, debating with you and others on here of your ilk is like talking to ignorant children.

The sort of person you don't take notice of is anybody who dares to challenge your covert racism, xenophobia and bigotry.

As for my response to Thicky, oh dear so me responding to his "fail" comment by telling him to take a look at his sad little life was more offensive than him posting a link to a far right facebook page then?

Someone aims a shot at me, I return that right back, look at thyself before acting like a superior arsehole.

So I'm in the wrong for rebutting his jibe, pointing out that he is in fact the fail and not me, but you are happy for such links to be posted on this forum? mm that kind of sums you up in a nutshell, an utter scumbag.

As far as i'm concerned you can all f@ck off, your mostly a sad bunch of utter ignorant w@nkers, of which you are clearly the biggest, judging by the utter bull**** you post on here.

Toodle pip sad old man, enjoy your make believe world in which you can make words mean whatever suits your bigoted views, it beggars belief that can even type to post.

[swaledale]

Liar liar, pants on fire

So esay to expose you Fail,
Full of **** and so far up your own ass, you must lick the stomach lining.

Calling a French / German/ Italian a bas*** is racist. Try it and see,
If anyone is the sad act here, it is you.

You are the epitomy of what's gone wrong with the political stances in the UK. One minute you're bragging that you are pocket millionaire, the next you're the spokesperson of the working class.
But that sums up the Labour infiltration of what was the working class party. Infiltrated by liberal, university champagne socialists like you, telling us poor people that you know better.

Anyway, one more time

Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/Liar/

OMG how utterly sad and childish can one get? How utterly stupid to not be able to distinguish between race and nationality, do you even understand the english language?

AS for lies, well seeing as you repeat utter tosh from dubious internet sites, I'm guessing you must be quite used to lies!

Anyway I shall think of you in your dead end job, bemoaning the fact that those who had the gumption and ability bettered themselves whilst those who didn't claimed victim status and moaned and whinged all the time. Now about that new car i'm looking for, maybe a tesla as one needs to save the planet and what shall i do tomorrow when you working for **** all?

Ha ha ha ha ha stupid pathetic little man go **** yourself, because nobody else will!

[Trickytreesreds]

I’m not actually defending the French attitude, Tricky...I don’t know enough about the ins and outs and I’m aware of areas of the British media who are, ridiculously, trying to blow all this ‘gun boat diplomacy’ into a second Falklands scenario.

Some will doubtless swallow it and see another opportunity for a rendition of ‘Britain Rules the Waves’...it’s rubbish imo...we’d be much better off being on good terms with our geographical neighbours and allies...as we were before the unnecessary jingoism of Brexit.

Don’t expect you to agree...Brexit is one of a number of issues which we will always disagree over.

I actually do agree with you RA. We should all work together to get along. But I'm afraid until one side stops acting like the local bully, we won't. You're a Brit and ex education. Since when did we pamper to bullies?

[Trickytreesreds]

Oh f@ck off you odious stupid little man, childishly repeating something that is obviously incorrect I mean explain how a Uk white citizen can make a racist remark about other white Uk citizens? Its obviously not racist, but as i observed before, stating that white is black when it clearly isn't does not mean its black, it just means the person who said that is stupid.

I thought even you would be capable of understanding the english language but clearly not.

Venting? of course I vent when confronted with an covert xenophobe and racist like you, who hides behind a mask of respectability whilst clearly being a narrow minded little Englander who hasn't a ****ing clue what he is talking about.

As for reasonable argument making you think? What a liar you are! You don't respond to reasonable argument, you don't even acknowledge when your utterly wrong, you nit pick little details and sneer, ignoring the main argument, debating with you and others on here of your ilk is like talking to ignorant children.

The sort of person you don't take notice of is anybody who dares to challenge your covert racism, xenophobia and bigotry.

As for my response to Thicky, oh dear so me responding to his "fail" comment by telling him to take a look at his sad little life was more offensive than him posting a link to a far right facebook page then?

Someone aims a shot at me, I return that right back, look at thyself before acting like a superior arsehole.

So I'm in the wrong for rebutting his jibe, pointing out that he is in fact the fail and not me, but you are happy for such links to be posted on this forum? mm that kind of sums you up in a nutshell, an utter scumbag.

As far as i'm concerned you can all f@ck off, your mostly a sad bunch of utter ignorant w@nkers, of which you are clearly the biggest, judging by the utter bull**** you post on here.

Toodle pip sad old man, enjoy your make believe world in which you can make words mean whatever suits your bigoted views, it beggars belief that can even type to post.

I got a yellow for circumnavigating the swear filter with one word Fail. You on the other hand cannot put one sentence together, without swearing your head off and insulting folks personally. You ARE the child on here.
Common denominator is always you.
anyone DISAGREES with you, then you explode into a torrent of abuse.
Yes my post was childish, in reponse to your childish slurs, but it worked and you swallowed the hook to the gullet.

You need help really, you seriously do.



Oh and just to clear up the racist definition in the laws eyes, because you seem culpable to end up in court.

For the purposes of the Act, a racial group is "a group of persons defined by reference to race, colour, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origins."

[Trickytreesreds]

On a side note. Brexit is still prominant in the minds of the electorate.

Kier Starmer i obviously off his tree to forget that. Whilst he was crying about Johnsons curtains, he puts a rabid remoaner up for the seat in Hartlepool.

O'dear, how has that gone then?
First time EVER!! A TORY wins.

Will Labour ever learn?
Hijacked by Liberal/university snobs, who don't have a clue how to connect with the average Joe on the UK.
Champagne socialists, more obsessed with their own beliefs, than their constituents.

[Andy_Faber]

OMG how utterly sad and childish can one get?

Gotta agree with Swale on this, your response does you no favours tricky, the Liar thing comes over as real school playground stuff, as the current phrase goes 'not good optics'. Try to stick to 12 font insults (and less repeats, we get the message)

[Andy_Faber]

On a side note. Brexit is still prominant in the minds of the electorate.

Kier Starmer i obviously off his tree to forget that. Whilst he was crying about Johnsons curtains, he puts a rabid remoaner up for the seat in Hartlepool.

O'dear, how has that gone then?
First time EVER!! A TORY wins.

Will Labour ever learn?
Hijacked by Liberal/university snobs, who don't have a clue how to connect with the average Joe on the UK.
Champagne socialists, more obsessed with their own beliefs, than their constituents.

As a matter of enlightenment to me Tricky, would you consider yourself fundamentally a Labour Party supporter/voter historically?

[Trickytreesreds]

As a matter of enlightenment to me Tricky, would you consider yourself fundamentally a Labour Party supporter/voter historically?

I was Andy.
I was born in a 2 up 2 down terrace.
I started an apprenticeship with British Coal in 82 at 16.
I always voted Labour until I saw what Blair was doing, then the way labour corrected him, by diving into left extremism.
Over the years I have voted Labour/Tory/Libs (cough)/ UKIP.

Why?
Because I vote for someone who wants to deliver what I ask for. There is too many biased voters today, who would vote for a chimpanzee in the right coloured rosette. Or are institutionally biased against an opposition.

As Hartlepool proved today, the demographics of politics has changed dramatically.
London the capital, full of student protesters and university champagne socialists, has become the Labour stronghold. Detached from its original heartlands and core.
They don't listen to them, nor show any interest other than their own and championing minorities to an excess.

Unelectable until, they sort themselves out.

[Andy_Faber]

I was Andy.
I was born in a 2 up 2 down terrace.
I started an apprenticeship with British Coal in 82 at 16.
I always voted Labour until I saw what Blair was doing, then the way labour corrected him, by diving into left extremism.
Over the years I have voted Labour/Tory/Libs (cough)/ UKIP.

Why?
Because I vote for someone who wants to deliver what I ask for. There is too many biased voters today, who would vote for a chimpanzee in the right coloured rosette. Or are institutionally biased against an opposition.

As Hartlepool proved today, the demographics of politics has changed dramatically.
London the capital, full of student protesters and university champagne socialists, has become the Labour stronghold. Detached from its original heartlands and core.
They don't listen to them, nor show any interest other than their own and championing minorities to an excess.

Unelectable until, they sort themselves out.

Worryingly, I agree with most of that and always vote with my personal opinion not 'by rosette'.

I have no party allegiance and don't even get involved in political discussion away from the internet, apart from arguing down that most extreme of political forces, The Bigot Party

Thanks for the enlightenment

[ramAnag]

Can you define what you mean by ‘Liberal/university snob’ please Tricky?

I too was brought up in a two bedroomed house located in one of the few, after yesterday, remaining Labour heartlands.

I’m aware that my ‘escape route’ owes virtually everything to those two accidents of birth...good, caring and healthily ambitious parents and being relatively bright. I voted Labour yesterday not because of any great faith in the Party (although I do admire Starmer) but as a vote against the flag hijacking, jingoistic politics of greed and selfishness that, imo, today’s Tory leaders represent.

[Trickytreesreds]

Can you define what you mean by ‘Liberal/university snob’ please Tricky?

I too was brought up in a two bedroomed house located in one of the few, after yesterday, remaining Labour heartlands.

I’m aware that my ‘escape route’ owes virtually everything to those two accidents of birth...good, caring and healthily ambitious parents and being relatively bright. I voted Labour yesterday not because of any great faith in the Party (although I do admire Starmer) but as a vote against the flag hijacking, jingoistic politics of greed and selfishness that, imo, today’s Tory leaders represent.

By Liberal/university snob, I am aiming mainly at London. That seems to be full of extremes singing the same anti Tory song
The scruffs, protesting etc I understand.
But the university, plummy voiced activists. Who are far from working class, yet seem to think my opinion is so wrong, pisses me right off.
Have listen to this clown. The accent etc, wants to be a doctor and wishes him a "horrible death"

Probably never done a days graft in her life, nor striggled having enough money or finding a job to feed the family.
So far detached from socialism it's laughable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpRlGAv6Ifo&ab_channel=Dr.HannibalLester

As for the flag waving.
Well, it depends how you mean it. What's wrong with proud of your nationality?
Why does elements in Labour want to shame me for being British?
Why does elements in Labour slur Brexit voters as thick racist little englanders? ( yes I know that sounds like swale)
The only party playing flag hijacking at the moment is Labour, with Starmer getting ridiculed from within his own party.

Its things like this and Labour councillors cheering on the French and EU with their games, that gets folks back up.
It may be what you want to hear and good for you.
But ask yourself why Labour couldn't score in a brothel at the moment and whose opinion has more clout.

[Andy_Faber]

I voted Labour yesterday not because of any great faith in the Party (although I do admire Starmer) but as a vote against the flag hijacking, jingoistic politics of greed and selfishness that, imo, today’s Tory leaders represent.

I admire your loyalty rA although you do fall into the trap of voting based on an issue that wasn't in the manifesto, which you described the other day as 'ridiculous'. Your stance on the morals etc of the Tories is again admirable (and no doubt would be equally so if Labour were in the dock) but the word on the street (by which I mean social media and a number of official polls) is that Boris' gf's taste in wallpaper and it's primary funding just don't matter (at the mo) to the electorate. I actually agree with you to some extent, and I voted (new) Labour in '97 as an anti-Tory-sleeze vote, I only see current Tory shenanigans as minor league compared to that era though, the late 90s Tories set the bar BLOODY high