OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[ramAnag]

You’re probably right about not having mentioned them but please don’t keep trying to catch me out/prove me wrong, it gets tiresome. And remember that my original comment wasn’t party political, merely that the worker bees are doing their big to keep the wheels of government turning

Andy...I don’t have to ‘try’ and I certainly don’t have to ‘keep trying’. You do it to yourself. On the one hand (post #8324) you refer to ‘two ministers you’ve slated over the years’ and after the most rudimentary of checks it’s found to be demonstrably untrue.
What am I meant to do? I don’t really care what your ‘original comment’ was...if you state people have said things or behaved in a certain way then expect to be challenged when you’ve written bollux.

[Andy_Faber]

Andy...I don’t have to ‘try’ and I certainly don’t have to ‘keep trying’. You do it to yourself. On the one hand (post #8324) you refer to ‘two ministers you’ve slated over the years’ and after the most rudimentary of checks it’s found to be demonstrably untrue.
What am I meant to do? I don’t really care what your ‘original comment’ was...if you state people have said things or behaved in a certain way then expect to be challenged when you’ve written bollux.

Not so much Bollux as a better power of recall than you, Zahawi has indeed been a ‘minor league object of your disdain’, proof by pm if you wish and apology accepted in the same manner so we don’t clutter up the thread

[ramAnag]

Not so much Bollux as a better power of recall than you, Zahawi has indeed been a ‘minor league object of your disdain’, proof by pm if you wish and apology accepted in the same manner so we don’t clutter up the thread

Andy...having difficulty keeping up. So far you’ve meandered through, ‘two ministers you’ve slated regularly...’ to ‘a minor league object of your disdain’...to ‘you’re probably right about not having mentioned them...’ to ‘proof by pm...’
Always willing to apologise when wrong AF. If Zahawi is one of ‘two ministers I’ve slated over the years’ (your original words) then feel free to expose my mistake publicly, no need for a pm. Be out till the evening but I’ll readily apologise if wrong.

[ramAnag]

Andy...having difficulty keeping up. So far you’ve meandered through, ‘two ministers you’ve slated regularly...’ to ‘a minor league object of your disdain’...to ‘you’re probably right about not having mentioned them...’ to ‘proof by pm...’
Always willing to apologise when wrong AF. If Zahawi is one of ‘two ministers I’ve slated over the years’ (your original words) then feel free to expose my mistake publicly, no need for a pm. Be out till the evening but I’ll readily apologise if wrong.

Still waiting.

[Andy_Faber]

Still waiting.

On or around 6/1/2021 ramAnag said

Nadim Zahawi has just been made the Minister in charge of Vaccinations.
Two years ago he was Minister for Children and Families...then he became Minister for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy.
It must be amazing to be an expert in such diverse areas.
and
as was my point with Zahawi, we need to look for a better system than ministers who ‘jump from role to role with each reshuffle’.

So I'd class that as a 'minor league' object of your disdain. As your post was sarcastic in nature rather than a Williamsonesque full-on assault, and aimed as much as HMG as a whole as it was at NZ, no need for an apolgy if that will end the spat

[Geoff Parkstone]

Can we go back to the fish puns that have been the backbone of this thread for many years. there is a thyme and a plaice for this political pollocks elsewhere

[ramAnag]

On or around 6/1/2021 ramAnag said

Nadim Zahawi has just been made the Minister in charge of Vaccinations.
Two years ago he was Minister for Children and Families...then he became Minister for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy.
It must be amazing to be an expert in such diverse areas.
and
as was my point with Zahawi, we need to look for a better system than ministers who ‘jump from role to role with each reshuffle’.

So I'd class that as a 'minor league' object of your disdain. As your post was sarcastic in nature rather than a Williamsonesque full-on assault, and aimed as much as HMG as a whole as it was at NZ, no need for an apolgy if that will end the spat

Lol...is that it? That’s you’re best example of ‘two ministers (I’ve) slated recently’ is it. Even allowing you to change the ground rules of your original comment it’s taken you over 24 hours to come up with that?
It’s not even a criticism of Zahawi...it’s a criticism of the system...it’s drawing attention to the problem of having non experts in expert positions. It’s asking the question...how can individuals retain credibility when they are expected to have knowledge of such wide and differing areas of governmental responsibility? I mean...how many positions has Zahawi not held in the last two or three years?
You really do need to accept that sometimes you can be wrong and this is one of them.
This government is inept Andy. The current situation is unacceptable. Have a look at the news. Three or four on here have been pointing out the warning signals for years...I’d suggest you take more notice of that than making silly claims about me and if I had written your school report it would have said, ‘young Andrew must do better’.

[MadAmster]

This government is inept. The current situation is unacceptable. Have a look at the news. Three or four on here have been pointing out the warning signals for years...I’d suggest you take more notice of that than making silly claims about me and if I had written your school report it would have said, ‘young Andrew must do better’.

You're far too kind to them rA. They are surging further wrong towards the extreme right of the political spectrum, cheered on by the richest 1% of the populace whose bidding they are doing. Grant Shapps involving himself in an industrial dispute between rail workers and the operating companies. PRIVATE companies. He is telling them what they can and can't do. It's not his place to do that. He's overstepping the mark. The whole lot of them making sure their friends, families, donors, sponsors and local pub landlord got their hands on contracts worth tens of millions or, in the case of track and trace around £40Bn and in the majority of cases those winning the contracts had no experience whatsoever in PPE (never arrived or didn't meet the required standards) or T&T (which proved completely unsuccessful and had people doing no more than phoning people to ask T&T questions earning a couple of grand a day) or, in the case of the App cocked up by Cummings' girl friend's company, never worked at all yet the irish built one that did work and it cost €850K, They offered it to HMG and they refused it..... nowt in it for their friends? All of this, if not corrupt, is very close IMO.

Then there's the wish to ditch human rights because it's stopping them reaching their objectives. If that is true then they need to come up with a new set of objectives that don't breach Human Rights.

Shapps et al are out to weaken the Trades Unions even more, it seems, to add more power to employer's elbows.

The right to protest has already taken a good kicking.

I may well be up to reason nr 3000 why I will not be returning to the UK to live.

Rail workers out. Barristers out. Lowestoft docks out. General strike on the way?

Could it be that they have finally seem the light and only now understand that 12 years of Toraidh Austerity and damned awful mismanagement have all but ruined the country and that Scots indy looks ever likely which, IMO, will right royally screw the rest of the UK financially, can't be stopped and they do NOT wish to be the party in power when it happens. Don't be surprised if there's a snap election called within the next 9 months, one that the Toraidh genuinely hope to lose.

[ramAnag]

You're far too kind to them rA. They are surging further wrong towards the extreme right of the political spectrum, cheered on by the richest 1% of the populace whose bidding they are doing. Grant Shapps involving himself in an industrial dispute between rail workers and the operating companies. PRIVATE companies. He is telling them what they can and can't do. It's not his place to do that. He's overstepping the mark. The whole lot of them making sure their friends, families, donors, sponsors and local pub landlord got their hands on contracts worth tens of millions or, in the case of track and trace around £40Bn and in the majority of cases those winning the contracts had no experience whatsoever in PPE (never arrived or didn't meet the required standards) or T&T (which proved completely unsuccessful and had people doing no more than phoning people to ask T&T questions earning a couple of grand a day) or, in the case of the App cocked up by Cummings' girl friend's company, never worked at all yet the irish built one that did work and it cost €850K, They offered it to HMG and they refused it..... nowt in it for their friends? All of this, if not corrupt, is very close IMO.

Then there's the wish to ditch human rights because it's stopping them reaching their objectives. If that is true then they need to come up with a new set of objectives that don't breach Human Rights.

Shapps et al are out to weaken the Trades Unions even more, it seems, to add more power to employer's elbows.

The right to protest has already taken a good kicking.

I may well be up to reason nr 3000 why I will not be returning to the UK to live.

Rail workers out. Barristers out. Lowestoft docks out. General strike on the way?

Could it be that they have finally seem the light and only now understand that 12 years of Toraidh Austerity and damned awful mismanagement have all but ruined the country and that Scots indy looks ever likely which, IMO, will right royally screw the rest of the UK financially, can't be stopped and they do NOT wish to be the party in power when it happens. Don't be surprised if there's a snap election called within the next 9 months, one that the Toraidh genuinely hope to lose.

I know...but honestly if you tell it like it really is too much on here you simply get accused of moaning, whinging, slating, being anti-democratic, extremist, a liberal leftie etc...etc.

I think your appraisal is spot on and you haven’t even mentioned the other huge topical issues here at the moment...the questions of water supply, sewage management and the fact that millions are likely to be unable to keep warm next winter. I wonder what those three issues have in common?
Honestly I can’t remember such a level of comparative disquiet since the 80’s but...and whisper this quietly...don’t mention who’s now had a dozen years in power or the level of corruption seen more recently...they really don’t like it.

[swaledale]

You're far too kind to them rA. They are surging further wrong towards the extreme right of the political spectrum, cheered on by the richest 1% of the populace whose bidding they are doing. Grant Shapps involving himself in an industrial dispute between rail workers and the operating companies. PRIVATE companies. He is telling them what they can and can't do. It's not his place to do that. He's overstepping the mark. The whole lot of them making sure their friends, families, donors, sponsors and local pub landlord got their hands on contracts worth tens of millions or, in the case of track and trace around £40Bn and in the majority of cases those winning the contracts had no experience whatsoever in PPE (never arrived or didn't meet the required standards) or T&T (which proved completely unsuccessful and had people doing no more than phoning people to ask T&T questions earning a couple of grand a day) or, in the case of the App cocked up by Cummings' girl friend's company, never worked at all yet the irish built one that did work and it cost €850K, They offered it to HMG and they refused it..... nowt in it for their friends? All of this, if not corrupt, is very close IMO.

Then there's the wish to ditch human rights because it's stopping them reaching their objectives. If that is true then they need to come up with a new set of objectives that don't breach Human Rights.

Shapps et al are out to weaken the Trades Unions even more, it seems, to add more power to employer's elbows.

The right to protest has already taken a good kicking.

I may well be up to reason nr 3000 why I will not be returning to the UK to live.

Rail workers out. Barristers out. Lowestoft docks out. General strike on the way?

Could it be that they have finally seem the light and only now understand that 12 years of Toraidh Austerity and damned awful mismanagement have all but ruined the country and that Scots indy looks ever likely which, IMO, will right royally screw the rest of the UK financially, can't be stopped and they do NOT wish to be the party in power when it happens. Don't be surprised if there's a snap election called within the next 9 months, one that the Toraidh genuinely hope to lose.

AS for those ****ing barristers, bleeding heart lefty liberals all of them!!

I reckon MA that Truss and Rees- Mogg doubling down on the "idle UK worker" may well do the trick when it comes to the next election, but then with voters as dumb as some brits, they may even agree with that, not realising of course that its them Truss and Rees-Mogg are talking about - as like the human rights issue people a very keen on anything that seems to affect other people, but not so keen when it applies to them later on down the line! I go back to the Nazi's and the "good german" situation here, oh yes scrapping human rights for immigrants" is fine. oh you mean your scrapping mine too? Hang on a minute!!

[swaledale]

You’re probably right about not having mentioned them but please don’t keep trying to catch me out/prove me wrong, it gets tiresome. And remember that my original comment wasn’t party political, merely that the worker bees are doing their big to keep the wheels of government turning

Only because you are very often wrong.. that must be very tiresome to be made to look foolish on so many occasions, but then as I keep telling you, best keep quiet and nobody would have noticed, but that genie is out of the bottle now.

[Geoff Parkstone]

an interesting observation about government being out to weaken the trade unions. IMO they are already on their knees with the growth of home working, the gig economy and the death of industry in Britain. The unions that are left (if I may be excused the expression, them all being left ) with any power are curiously a diverse group who are not your traditional union fodder from the early days of the movement - teachers (who allege themselves professionals) train drivers (who earn way in excess of the national average income already) and the civil service pen pushers aka UNISON. UNITE is a curious amalgam of sectors where a lot of self employment goes on too (construction, transport).

What we call unions today are a far cry from the unions in the early part of the 20th century or even the 1970's, fighting for employment rights, workplace conditions etc. Very much focussed on maximising members earnings rather than the working conditions IMHO and are possibly going for one last hurrah at holding the country to ransom for cash.

[ramAnag]

Only because you are very often wrong.. that must be very tiresome to be made to look foolish on so many occasions, but then as I keep telling you, best keep quiet and nobody would have noticed, but that genie is out of the bottle now.

As regards the recent state of British beaches...whatever you do don’t mention the ‘TurdReich’ to AF.

[Andy_Faber]

Only because you are very often wrong.. that must be very tiresome to be made to look foolish on so many occasions, but then as I keep telling you, best keep quiet and nobody would have noticed, but that genie is out of the bottle now.

Well done, a whole first sentence without swearing, name calling or other accusation of some sort

I was nosing through old messages earlier and came across (its hard to avoid) a conversation from earlier this year in which a poster of some 15 years standing and many thousands of posts dared to make a non-football comment to which your reply was so full of insults he left the board shortly after.

With more accessible social media like facebook its difficult to keep a php board like this going, and you've done more than anyone (in fact more than everyone else combined IMO) to kill this one. Do you not realise that you've created an echo chamber where MA, ramAnag and yourself can now vent to your heart's content with only the occasional poster daring to pop their heads over the parapet to offer a contrary view.

So well done Swale you've killed the board

[ramAnag]

What we call unions today are a far cry from the unions in the early part of the 20th century or even the 1970's, fighting for employment rights, workplace conditions etc. Very much focussed on maximising members earnings rather than the working conditions IMHO and are possibly going for one last hurrah at holding the country to ransom for cash.

Please explain how those currently facing a very significant cut in their living standards are ‘holding the country to ransom’ by asking for an appropriate wage increase.

Perhaps your opinion would have been more suited to the nine****th century however if you want examples of ‘holding the country to ransom’ I’d suggest some of the privatised companies might be considered more culpable...but you blame the teachers (who aren’t striking...yet) and the barristers, the rail workers and the Felixstowe dockers if it makes you feel better.

Unions today are a far cry from the early 20th Century and the 1970’s but certain attitudes amongst the financial ‘elite’ will rapidly see a return to increased unionisation imo. The cat is out of the proverbial bag GP...people will not continue to work for low wages with poor levels of job security while being simultaneously ever more aware of how much the fat cats are creaming off the top. The times they are a changing and not before time.