OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[Akwesasne]

I meant they get commercial qualifications eg project management, engineering etc to use once they've left the services.

Only if they learn't those skills in logistics whilst in service. There is'nt much demand in Civvy Street for ex-infantry men. Most have to compete with the lower skilled in the job's market and if traumatised or handicapped in anyway it's down to Care in the Community which doesn't exist. Hence the need for organisations like the British Legion.

[ramAnag]

But Roger...it would be the taxpayer paying, or making a contribution towards, a facility that the tax payer then benefits from. What's so wrong with that?
I too would love 'higher education to be free' but I doubt it's going to happen. Not in our lifetime at least. You've already suggested that you believe there to be some sort of 'pecking order' of importance/usefulness as far as University courses are concerned. Not sure we're talking here about a 'privileged' group, more 'essential state employees' (that does sound horribly Big Brother I know) who could 'lose' part of their training debt for every five years of NHS/NES employment...something like that.

As for the doctors' strike being 'less disruptive'...doesn't it all depend on circumstance? Not less disruptive if you're a childless person waiting for an operation on the day of the strike. Anyway, your argument ultimately just goes to show how important teachers are...not just there to educate but also to 'child mind' so the rest of society can go to work

[ramAnag]

QUOTE=AdiSalisbury;38206313]We currently pay to qualify service personnel (which I agree with), I would be happy to see it stretched to certain trades. Can we have a referendum, and claim that if I lose, that those who didn't vote definitely would have voted the same as me (see, still on topic)?[/QUOTE]

Not another referendum Adi please. See our economic growth forecast has already reduced to 1.6% for 2016 and 0.6% for 2017 on the back of Brexit. Thank you so much to NF (are those initials coincidental?) and Co. for that. Still

[roger_ramjet]

"But Roger...it would be the taxpayer paying, or making a contribution towards, a facility that the tax payer then benefits from. What's so wrong with that?"

Whats wrong with it is that the taxpayer currently gets the benefit without having to pay for it. If you are serious with your propoal, then I suggest that teachers should get free graduate and teacher training and be exempt from income tax and national insurance. They should also get a 60% pay cut. Seems to about equalise things in net pay terms.

After all what is the point in the exchequer paying the teachers and the teachers then paying tax to, erm, the exchequer

[roger_ramjet]

This would of course need to be coupled with pension reform giving them the same minimum pensions required to be paid by employers under new pension legislation.

Not forgetting the fact that they should be required to do unpaid community service during the long summer holidays as well as maybe during the other holidays, thus allowing them the same 4 or 5 weeks off per year that others are entitled to. Perhaps litter picking might suit as that is something they can do for society?

They should also be taxed on the free school meals they get!

See when you start comparing different remuneration packages it isnt always in your favour!!

[ramAnag]

Lol...bloody bean counters. Always over complicating things! All I'm suggesting is some way of incentivising teachers, doctors and graduate nurses etc. to remain in the public sector by offering a reward over a gradual period of time.

Got us within twenty of the big 400 anyway and post 378 should generate a few more...although I note most of the 'Leaves' have gone very quiet.

P.S. You only get a free school meal if and when you do a 'dinner duty'. The food's crap and the 'duty' is often worse.

P.P.S. If you really want to debate the working conditions of a typical teacher I'm happy to do so but it's a bit OT and you'll lose.

[roger_ramjet]

I think at least 37% of the population would agree with me about teachers getting way too much holiday - so you will lose

[ramAnag]

More than that I'd think, lots of bitter and twisted folk around and of course everyone has spent a large part of their formative years at school so everyone thinks they're an expert.
Tbf, I did say 'working conditions' not specifically 'holidays' but bring it on if you like.

[roger_ramjet]

Again

[AdiSalisbury]

QUOTE=AdiSalisbury;38206313]We currently pay to qualify service personnel (which I agree with), I would be happy to see it stretched to certain trades. Can we have a referendum, and claim that if I lose, that those who didn't vote definitely would have voted the same as me (see, still on topic)?

Not another referendum Adi please. See our economic growth forecast has already reduced to 1.6% for 2016 and 0.6% for 2017 on the back of Brexit. Thank you so much to NF (are those initials coincidental?) and Co. for that. Still [/QUOTE]

That's ok, FTSE was up today, industry is adjusting, England have a new manager, and Joe Root is still n.o.

[ramAnag]

Again

Que?

[AngryRam]

They get way too much holiday... The trouble and strife is always home..
Needs to get a proper job.

[AngryRam]

Not another referendum Adi please. See our economic growth forecast has already reduced to 1.6% for 2016 and 0.6% for 2017 on the back of Brexit. Thank you so much to NF (are those initials coincidental?) and Co. for that. Still

That's ok, FTSE was up today, industry is adjusting, England have a new manager, and Joe Root is still n.o. [/QUOTE]

Is not our economic growth forecast better than most of the EU?

[ramAnag]

That's ok, FTSE was up today, industry is adjusting, England have a new manager, and Joe Root is still n.o.

Is not our economic growth forecast better than most of the EU?
[/QUOTE]

Possibly...but ours is not as good as it was pre-Brexit.

She'll be home for the next six weeks now Angers...be able to spend loads of your 'hard earned' with nothing else to sidetrack her.

[AngryRam]

2 days in and we have our hair done ( how bleedin expensive is that ), nails, some treatment thing at the gym.. Still looks exactly the same. Oh and lunch with her mates.
Gonna be a long summer..