OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[roger_ramjet]

Mangara - you say you have done some cash in hand jobs but never fiddled your tax. Am I therefore right in concluding that you declared these cash in hand jobs on your tax return and to your then employers so that they could ensure your NI calculations correctly reflected the other income?

[roger_ramjet]

As to your friend on 11k salary then I have, based on the facts as you present them, nothing but contempt for him. However 11k is a magic number. Its the figure usually booked as salary for the self employed paying themselves via thei own company. The next 32k of income is paid as dividends and is untaxed on the individual BUT his company pays 20% tax instead. Thus he may say he pays no tax, but in this scenario his company pays it for him so noone loses. This does however legally save NI contributions - but youll have to pay to find out how and why!! 😊😊

[ramAnag]

Mangara - you say you have done some cash in hand jobs but never fiddled your tax. Am I therefore right in concluding that you declared these cash in hand jobs on your tax return and to your then employers so that they could ensure your NI calculations correctly reflected the other income?

God there's no escaping your pedantry today is there Rog? Answered that elsewhere...apart from typical student stuff - private tuition, bar work etc - little bit of decorating work and some writing...didn't amount to much, certainly not enough to justify the services of your colleagues. But you're right I'm a very naughty boy.

But Tricky makes a good point - yes I did just say that!! - there are the three types of 'scroungers' he identifies and the latter two may well be benefitting from a whole industry of accountants which is costing the country billions, yet we only demonise the obvious ones. Why?

P.S. The 11k guy is certainly no 'friend' of mine.

[Andy_Faber]

As to your friend on 11k salary then I have, based on the facts as you present them, nothing but contempt for him. However 11k is a magic number. Its the figure usually booked as salary for the self employed paying themselves via thei own company. The next 32k of income is paid as dividends and is untaxed on the individual BUT his company pays 20% tax instead. Thus he may say he pays no tax, but in this scenario his company pays it for him so noone loses. This does however legally save NI contributions - but youll have to pay to find out how and why!! 😊😊

Just to be up to date, from this tax year its taxed at 7.5% and then 32.5% depending on total income so this guy is either ignorant of tax law or telling fibs

[ramAnag]

Just to be up to date, from this tax year its taxed at 7.5% and then 32.5% depending on total income so this guy is either ignorant of tax law or telling fibs

Tbf...I did say 'used to know' and I am going back a few years.

[Ram59]

Anag, we'll have to agree to disagree because we're going round in circles. I just can't see how you as a person who avoids tax can criticise others, just because they avoid more. BTW, you've never answered my question, at what precise figure does it become immoral?

I'm not against benefit claimants on the whole, it's just the ones who have no intention of ever making any contribution to society.

[Andy_Faber]

Anag, we'll have to agree to disagree because we're going round in circles. I just can't see how you as a person who avoids tax can criticise others, just because they avoid more. BTW, you've never answered my question, at what precise figure does it become immoral?

I'm not against benefit claimants on the whole, it's just the ones who have no intention of ever making any contribution to society.

I think all the discussion on this pretty much confirms that there are no 'clean hands' (at least on this forum) on this subject

I agree with Ram59's last commment, and it brings us back round to the issue of EU (and I guess non-EU) immigration.

Earlier today the leader of the Welsh parliament Carwyn Jones explained his parliament's hopes for Brexit, which accepted that UK would leave the EU institution, but wants to retain a MODIFIED 'Single Market' with the key modification being 'free movement of people who have a job offer'. I think that sort of proposal has legs.

[ramAnag]

Anag, we'll have to agree to disagree because we're going round in circles. I just can't see how you as a person who avoids tax can criticise others, just because they avoid more. BTW, you've never answered my question, at what precise figure does it become immoral?

I'm not against benefit claimants on the whole, it's just the ones who have no intention of ever making any contribution to society.

Jesus Ram, I thought you and I had discovered some common ground but you really are pushing it. Me - 'as a person who avoids tax' - ffs let's keep this in perspective. I have been honest...throughout my working professional life I have never avoided or evaded paying tax or even fiddled my expenses. There have however been a few occasions when I have done some small jobs for a bit of cash and haven't declared it. It amounts to hundreds of pounds and is on a par with Andy saying that although he would never have 'bootlegged' music or films in his home he isn't averse to asking for a 'cash' price.
I've also had adulterous relationships, been divorced, driven my car at 30 mph over the speed limit, smoked dope and once, when I was about 16, stole a Crosby Stills, Nash and Young album which, to my shame, I still possess. Unlike you apparently I'm not a perfect person but in terms of doing good and bad things I reckon I'm comfortably in credit if not apparently the self righteous paragon of virtue that is Ram59.
But this isn't about us. It's about the fine lines between one form of scrounging from society and another. I accept your point about some benefit claimants but you seem only able to find fault with those you see in everyday life...those you can easily look down on. The point surely is that the bent bankers, crooked accountants (not you Roger), manipulative self employed (not all of them) and duplicitous ego driven politicians are far more responsible for the current situation than any amount of 'benefit scroungers'. A tax avoiding, misogynistic, xenophobic madman has just been elected as the most powerful man on the planet. That's something to get angry about but as long as people like you believe the 'alternative facts' and choose not to look further than the end of your nose then nothing will change.

[AdiSalisbury]

^^ Is it a good time to admit that I work for the police

[ramAnag]

^^ Is it a good time to admit that I work for the police

Lol...thanks for that...brightened my day.

[roger_ramjet]

Steven Stills is one of my clients and would like a word

[Andy_Faber]

^^ Is it a good time to admit that I work for the police

Surely CSNY's crimes against music are outside UK juresdiction

[Ram59]

Jesus Ram, I thought you and I had discovered some common ground but you really are pushing it. Me - 'as a person who avoids tax' - ffs let's keep this in perspective. I have been honest...throughout my working professional life I have never avoided or evaded paying tax or even fiddled my expenses. There have however been a few occasions when I have done some small jobs for a bit of cash and haven't declared it. It amounts to hundreds of pounds and is on a par with Andy saying that although he would never have 'bootlegged' music or films in his home he isn't averse to asking for a 'cash' price.
I've also had adulterous relationships, been divorced, driven my car at 30 mph over the speed limit, smoked dope and once, when I was about 16, stole a Crosby Stills, Nash and Young album which, to my shame, I still possess. Unlike you apparently I'm not a perfect person but in terms of doing good and bad things I reckon I'm comfortably in credit if not apparently the self righteous paragon of virtue that is Ram59.
But this isn't about us. It's about the fine lines between one form of scrounging from society and another. I accept your point about some benefit claimants but you seem only able to find fault with those you see in everyday life...those you can easily look down on. The point surely is that the bent bankers, crooked accountants (not you Roger), manipulative self employed (not all of them) and duplicitous ego driven politicians are far more responsible for the current situation than any amount of 'benefit scroungers'. A tax avoiding, misogynistic, xenophobic madman has just been elected as the most powerful man on the planet. That's something to get angry about but as long as people like you believe the 'alternative facts' and choose not to look further than the end of your nose then nothing will change.

You have completely missed my point, I have not claimed to be whiter than white. What I have said, is that being a person doing similar practises as yourself, I suspect that if I was in the same position as those corporate/rich people, them I would also be tempted to avoid tax. It would be on the grounds of I've paid enough tax and others do it, so why shouldn't I. But I would never act as a scrounger. That's why they offend my morals more.

I keep asking and you never answer, AT WHAT FIGURE do you consider tax avoidance to be immoral? You admit to hundreds of pounds but don't like millions, where in the middle do you draw the line?

BTW, just £100 of your hundreds, by every tax payer would add up to £3 billion, enough to build 6 major hospitals!

[Trickytreesreds]

^^ Is it a good time to admit that I work for the police

Well you're the biggest crook in here then, lmaoooooooooooooo

[Trickytreesreds]

[QUOTE=ramAnag;38408174]Jesus Ram, I thought you and I had discovered some common ground but you really are pushing it. Me - 'as a person who avoids tax' - ffs let's keep this in perspective. I have been honest...throughout my working professional life I have never avoided or evaded paying tax or even fiddled my expenses. There have however been a few occasions when I have done some small jobs for a bit of cash and haven't declared it. It amounts to hundreds of pounds and is on a par with Andy saying that although he would never have 'bootlegged' music or films in his home he isn't averse to asking for a 'cash' price.
I've also had adulterous relationships, been divorced, driven my car at 30 mph over the speed limit, smoked dope and once, when I was about 16, stole a Crosby Stills, Nash and Young album which, to my shame, I still possess. Unlike you apparently I'm not a perfect person but in terms of doing good and bad things I reckon I'm comfortably in credit if not apparently the self righteous paragon of virtue that is Ram59.


You may as well come all the way out the closet now Ramanag. You missed off the bestiality and necrophilia lol