OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[ramAnag]

…but which one?

Who knows? Whichever it is you seem quite incapable of reading the writing on the wall as far as the impact of Brexit and a Brexiteer PM on our country are concerned.

[swaledale]

For Liz Truss and her government, post-Brexit politics is proving to be impossible. They want life outside the EU to mean small state, low tax economics, public spending cuts and a smaller welfare state – which is not what millions of leave supporters thought they were voting for in the 2016 referendum, nor what the Tories offered in the two elections that followed.

Meanwhile, Brexit’s endless constraints in pursuit of growth threatens to tie the government in knots.

Then you have that daughter of an economic migrant Suella Braverman, a classic example of modern Conservatism’s nastiness and introversion, says she wants to cut net migration to “tens of thousands” and dreaming of a plane taking asylum seekers to Rwanda!!


At the same time, the penny has struck the government, that growth without people to do the work is impossible so it wants to liberalise the UK’s immigration system, (Mr Spoons himself has been clamouring for this ironically!) and send a certain kind of Brexit voter into paroxysms of fury. Especially as we seem to be replacing immigration from the EU, with immigration from the rest of the world!

The absurd logic of Truss and her allies’ position cannot hold: as the Brexit revolution that upturned Conservative politics and brought them to power unravels, the reason for their success is also why they will fail. Brexiteers have been lucky in that Covid and now the war in Ukraine has masked some of the effects of Brexit, though the effects of both have been worse due to Brexit, and provided a useful smokescreen to distract what is really happening from the 17 million odd who voted for it.

Some good news though, the UK can now sell lamb to the USA, a country that predominantly eats beef! So we buy lamb from New Zealand (as part of the new trade deal) and can sell ours to the USA. Mm that makes complete sense on both an economic and carbon saving level!!

[swaledale]

Who said anything about "not worrying"? I merely pointed out that the figures were already well known so not news, which it wasn't. the only "newsy" bit was ONS confirming what was already out there from many a qualified source.

As I said previously your post was pointless - of course its "news" when the governments own figures confirm Brexit is causing economic damage to the UK. previously they were able (as were Brexit supporters) that this was the case arguing that the statistics were either false or misinterpreted!

[swaledale]

you're really upset about this Brexit thing aren't you?

Well when you see a country basically shooting itself in the foot for no reason and in doing so negatively affecting its citizens, then yes it is upsetting.

But I could have lived with leaving the EU, IF we'd stayed within the Customs Union and single market. Given there was no overwhelming mandate for Brexit, then a hard Brexit was neither democratic or warranted.

[swaledale]

The scens of chaos and division within the Tory party are the inevitable result of the decision to leave the EU. Since the referendum, British governments have demonstrated, with ever greater talent, that Brexit only takes the UK further away from the promised land of recovered sovereignty and untrammelled freedom, as each promise, each lie is shown to be undeliverable, the smoke screen of Covid and then the war in Ukraine cannot hide what an absolute **** show it is.

As the economy tanks much more than it would ahve done without Brexit, never mind Truss' fantasy economic experiment, all those who voted for Brexit can now congratulate themselves on having achieved a country, which is poorer by around £400 million per week and counting, is now contemplating allowing hundreds of thousands of immigrants from outside the EU, to replace those from the EU in order to provide the workforce ***** for growth.

When they look, future historians would find the roots of British politics’ “current insanity” in 2016, Because Brexit has damaged the UK economy so lastingly that any extra market uncertainty leads to far greater turbulence than ever before.

Still at least we all have blue ****ing passports!!

[MadAmster]

Blue ones that look black

[swaledale]

Boris Johnson’s Brexit will slow down economic growth to the tune of £1,200 for every person in the country, the government’s spending watchdog has said.

" Brexit " appeared just twice in Chancellor Rishi Sunak’s first Budget speech despite the huge impact it’s predicted to have on the national finances.

The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) said based on current Brexit plans, growth would be slowed by around 4% in the long run.

They said part of the slowdown was a result of lower migration - but most was from a slump in business investment.

The body - set up by George Osborne to scrutinise Budgets - said the economy had only seen a third of the impact of Brexit so far.

Another third will happen over the next five years, and the remainder after 20

[swaledale]

“Without Brexit, we wouldn’t be talking about austerity this week,” Michael Saunders tells me in his first on-air interview since leaving the Bank of England’s monetary policy committee.

[Trickytreesreds]

Just back from Nurnburg.

OUT- quick check bording pass/passport at gate
quick look/stamp of passport German end

IN- Bording pass gate to enter departures German end
Quick look/stamp of passport. Auf Wiedersehn.
Brit end, self scan of passport at a gate.

All done in minutes.


Nurnburg, prices through the roof. I would normally not bother checking prices/look around whilst there. I fecking did this time, because most shop goods, were way more expensive than here.

Probably our fault though for leaving.

[ramAnag]

Just back from Nurnburg.

OUT- quick check bording pass/passport at gate
quick look/stamp of passport German end

IN- Bording pass gate to enter departures German end
Quick look/stamp of passport. Auf Wiedersehn.
Brit end, self scan of passport at a gate.

All done in minutes.


Nurnburg, prices through the roof. I would normally not bother checking prices/look around whilst there. I fecking did this time, because most shop goods, were way more expensive than here.

Probably our fault though for leaving.

Unsure of your point. Passports didn’t require stamping prior to Brexit so clearly you’re agreeing that the whole process of travelling within Europe has been slowed down. Yes it only takes moments to stamp a passport...moments x the number in front of you leaving or boarding the plane/ferry...or are you seriously suggesting that Brexit has enabled easier travel for Brits within Europe?

No one has suggested that we are the only country with higher prices or that inflation isn’t a global problem. However have you actually looked at the prices over here? Hugely more expensive here than when I was in Spain two months ago and from what I hear from those I know who live in northern Germany...very similar to the cost of living increases we face.

[Trickytreesreds]

Unsure of your point. Passports didn’t require stamping prior to Brexit so clearly you’re agreeing that the whole process of travelling within Europe has been slowed down. Yes it only takes moments to stamp a passport...moments x the number in front of you leaving or boarding the plane/ferry...or are you seriously suggesting that Brexit has enabled easier travel for Brits within Europe?

No one has suggested that we are the only country with higher prices or that inflation isn’t a global problem. However have you actually looked at the prices over here? Hugely more expensive here than when I was in Spain two months ago and from what I hear from those I know who live in northern Germany...very similar to the cost of living increases we face.

My point?

The Germans still sat in the same immigration booths that they did before. Only difference now, they stamped it. You regard that as an inconveniance? Then you are being unbelievably picky and arsey.
They would have flicked through it before to look at it, but now take 10 seconds longer?

Is that really a reason to get pissed off? Thailand next for 7 weeks. That route involves finger/thumb prints/photos/entrance visa to look at. Personally, I don't mind that either, but visiting another EU country is nothing like.

Of course I have looked at prices over here. But I stand by what I said. Goods from shops, were hugely more expensive than here and even buying some tit bits from a supermarket were pricey. I should have gone out of town and found a Lidl I suppose.
But there are plenty in this country, screaming about prices and blaming BREXIT FOR OUR WOES,Total bollox, as it is everywhere and Brexit is tiny on our impacts in prices.

I'll let you know how prices vary in Thailand in comparison.

[ramAnag]

Regarding travel I think all that’s been said is that Brexit has made travel for those from the UK within Europe harder and slower. It isn’t the most significant impact of Brexit but it has, undeniably, made things worse. Travel beyond our own continent has always been more complex so Thailand is hardly a fair comparison.

As for prices and the cost of living crisis I don’t know of anyone who has laid these issues exclusively at Brexit’s door however the inflation ‘League table’ of comparable European countries doesn’t make great reading.

France 6.2%
Spain 6.8%
Greece 9.1%
Netherlands 9.9%
Germany 10%
Belgium 10.6%
UK 11.1%
Italy 11.8%

You explain it.

[SithHappens]

Prices do not only differ from country to country, but from city to city, to town to town.

Take Belgium as an example, go out in Brussels and prices are significantly more than nearby Brugge. Try Spain, and go out in Barcelona and you will pay more than tourist resorts.

We went to France earlier in the year and to be fair it didn't seem any different at the border to the previous visits. I think people are more likely to hit trouble with security, check in and passport control in the UK than abroad (a consequence of low staff numbers which is a combination of laying staff off during covid, and the subsequent difficulties in setting people on, some of which will be brexit related)

This is for tourists though, other people are finding life post brexit much more challenging when trying to get on to the continent, the red tape and extra cost my wifes haulage company now experiences is evidence of that. Thats if they can get any drivers, although lots of bus drivers have helped fill the gap there its just left to an issue with the bus services in the Uk as they struggle for drivers, you only have to look locally at inconsistent buses and also the cancellation of some services.

Im still waiting to see anyone detail a benefit of brexit, by that it means something thats 'better' because of brexit, not thats the same, or only a bit worse than it used to be.

The only one i can think of is the head start we got on the vaccine program, but even then we could have done our own thing had we still been in the EU as others in the EU did so its not really.

When it comes to measuring results, predictions and analysis the OBR consistently tell us brexit is and will continue to have a negative effect on the economy, they said previously that brexit was having an effect twice as bad as that of the pandemic.

All things point to a rough ride for some time yet.

[Trickytreesreds]

Regarding travel I think all that’s been said is that Brexit has made travel for those from the UK within Europe harder and slower. It isn’t the most significant impact of Brexit but it has, undeniably, made things worse. Travel beyond our own continent has always been more complex so Thailand is hardly a fair comparison.

As for prices and the cost of living crisis I don’t know of anyone who has laid these issues exclusively at Brexit’s door however the inflation ‘League table’ of comparable European countries doesn’t make great reading.

France 6.2%
Spain 6.8%
Greece 9.1%
Netherlands 9.9%
Germany 10%
Belgium 10.6%
UK 11.1%
Italy 11.8%

You explain it.

Being an engineer and not a calculator puncher, you're asking the wrong man.
But in my limited knowledge, Tory failures and Bank of England failures come top of the reasons.

Also get your figures from places other than the Guardian mucker.
Its rife all over Europe

https://www.statista.com/statistics/225698/monthly-inflation-rate-in-eu-countries/

[ramAnag]

Okay...they weren’t from the Guardian...but have it your own way and you keep bringing up your belief in Brexit if it helps.
All the evidence points otherwise but heh ho...you can take a horse to water.

If you don’t want to take any notice of me then listen to Sith...he makes some excellent points above and seems particularly well informed regarding the shortage of drivers. It’s a problem I raised over a year ago but you, and he who is always right, dismissed it as unfounded and untrue.