Election Year or Fear!

[MadAmster]

TTR. Hitler - Dictator. Mussolini - Dictator. Putin - Dictator. Trump wants to be one. Have you seen his "Agenda 2025"? Dictator in waiting

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GRwqBQlaQAAPlci.jpg

[swaledale]

If there’s one thing worse than a poor loser it’s a poor winner…

If there's one thing worse than stupid person, its a stupid person who thinks he is clever!

For a start I'm not a "winner" or a "loser" in this election, which would be evident to any person with average critical thinking ability who is able to see politics outside the very narrow right/left perspective.

Secondly, any person who considers Reform to be either a serious political party or that their "policies" are in any way realistic, workable or a even a reasonable point of view clearly lacks a working cognitive function.

I do understand that for many people, critical thinking isn't something they are capable of, which they demonstrate when giving an opinion or posting crap on here. That may be not their fault, highly likely they aren't capable, or they may just be lazy thinkers, either way the end result is the same.

I'd always recommend keeping quiet if you don't understand what's being said!

[swaledale]

No, not ‘a comparison’…seven, very easy, parallels… ‘comparisons’ if you prefer.
Still, if you just want to return to being ‘Capt.YouTube’, have someone else make your points and shift the debate somewhere else, that’s up to you.
I’ve got better things to do…oh and I’m not sure how your beloved Nigel is being ‘persecuted’ but I’m certainly not involved. I’m just supporting the description of him being an ‘awful human being’.

rA, best do what I've done an ignore the tw@t!

Though it might be pertinent to note that Reform got basically the same proportion of the vote that UKIP did in 2015, which suggests that any suggestion there is a groundswell or support for a far right party in the UK isn't true.

[Geoff Parkstone]

rA, best do what I've done an ignore the tw@t!

Though it might be pertinent to note that Reform got basically the same proportion of the vote that UKIP did in 2015, which suggests that any suggestion there is a groundswell or support for a far right party in the UK isn't true.

I disagree with that last assertion. UKIP was essentially a one trick pony and attracted a wider audience and broader support than Reform because of it. Reform does not have that single purpose agenda, although it will have certain elements of UKIP old guard supporting it. For Reform to attract as much, if not a tad more, support "than 2015" is disturbing and indicative of a shift in UK ground level support. Keep your head in the sand by all means, but the share of the vote gained by Reform IS indicative of a change in the making - and not a positive change either. Parliament may have swung left yet perversely the electorate haven't.

[Andy_Faber]

rA, best do what I've done an ignore the tw@t!

Though it might be pertinent to note that Reform got basically the same proportion of the vote that UKIP did in 2015, which suggests that any suggestion there is a groundswell or support for a far right party in the UK isn't true.

Agreeing yet again with GP, your bigotry is blinding you to the differences between UKIP and Reform. There’s a groundswell of support driven by a feeling of being passed over, and You can call such people all the names you want, they are there and growing whether you, I or GP like it or not, and just calling people names will only swell the ranks, how do you think the undecided feel when your potty mouthed demeanour makes it seem like you’re still in shorts?

[ramAnag]

I disagree with that last assertion. UKIP was essentially a one trick pony and attracted a wider audience and broader support than Reform because of it. Reform does not have that single purpose agenda, although it will have certain elements of UKIP old guard supporting it. For Reform to attract as much, if not a tad more, support "than 2015" is disturbing and indicative of a shift in UK ground level support. Keep your head in the sand by all means, but the share of the vote gained by Reform IS indicative of a change in the making - and not a positive change either. Parliament may have swung left yet perversely the electorate haven't.

Take your point about the support for Reform being ‘disturbing’, GP…but they do remain an ‘essentially one trick pony’ appealing to those who bleat on endlessly about immigration and small boats.

You’re right…the election results would have been very different without the impact of Reform on the traditional Tory vote, but their appeal is largely only to those who, like Tricky, wanted immigration to be the main General Election issue whereas actually what happened is, imo, that the cost of living, the NHS and the question of political integrity amongst our leaders proved to be the nation’s priorities.

Reform have nothing to offer on the major issues and I’d be surprised if Farage lasts long as MP for Clacton. He’ll welcome the salary but, as Swale has suggested, his narcissism and ego won’t allow the comparative anonymity and responsibility of being just another constituency MP.
I’d be surprised if he hasn’t moved on to another vanity project within the next 18 months.

[swaledale]

I disagree with that last assertion. UKIP was essentially a one trick pony and attracted a wider audience and broader support than Reform because of it. Reform does not have that single purpose agenda, although it will have certain elements of UKIP old guard supporting it. For Reform to attract as much, if not a tad more, support "than 2015" is disturbing and indicative of a shift in UK ground level support. Keep your head in the sand by all means, but the share of the vote gained by Reform IS indicative of a change in the making - and not a positive change either. Parliament may have swung left yet perversely the electorate haven't.

Same shysters different name, different party (or to be precise, private company). Reform has essentially the same agenda, obvs Brexit isn't a live issue, but other than that its just shifted the focus, but the same old tropes are being promoted. Reform has one purpose and why its backed by billionaires who clearly don't have the interests of most voters in mind. Which is to keep repeating what UKIP did on Immigration, Human Rights, the NHS etc. in order to shift the "Overton Window" further to the right and persuade people that for instance An insurance based health system (as per the US, not as in Europe) is in the only solution, that removing human rights is in all our interests, when in reality its in the interests of the companies and investment funds they make their wedge from and purely that.

In the region of 50% of the reform support comes from disaffected Tories who used it as a protest vote, they may on the whole be right leaning, but would not vote for Reform next time.

I don't believe the electorate have changed that much, given the number of times the Tory party have been voted into power compared to Labour, it has always been the case that for some puzzling reason those least likely to benefit from a Tory government have often enthusiastically voted for them, something in the human psyche I guess.

What is clear is greater voter volatility and what's more worrying voter apathy, with a 60% turn out, that is concerning, though how many of those were Tories that sat on their hands in protest, those that thought it was a slam dunk that labour would win or those just completely turned off by politics is unclear.

There is no evidence to suggest the electorate or the country is more right wing than previously and Without a party merger, Reform hasn't the infrastructure or the personnel to organise effectively. Its not about keeping ones head in the sand, its about careful analysis of the facts. Of course Labour needs to be successful in showing that "grown up" cohesive stable politics (the boring stuff) works.

[ramAnag]

I do notice, that no one really wants to talk about the rise of the right in Europe, which currently is far higher than here.
Is that an inconvinient truth that bursts the left/ globalist bubble, that the EU has pushed?

Maybe you trips to France are in danger RA?

Can anyone explain this properly, without blaming Farage?

Oops! I can certainly explain that things in France don’t seem to have gone quite as you’ve been predicting, Tricky.
Not really having the best of weeks are you?

[Trickytreesreds]

Agreeing yet again with GP, your bigotry is blinding you to the differences between UKIP and Reform. There’s a groundswell of support driven by a feeling of being passed over, and You can call such people all the names you want, they are there and growing whether you, I or GP like it or not, and just calling people names will only swell the ranks, how do you think the undecided feel when your potty mouthed demeanour makes it seem like you’re still in shorts?

He should go to France, he'll enjoy it.

The left/far left/ Islamists collude to stop the popular vote.
They riot and burn things in protest of Round one Le Pen win
They riot and burn things to celebrate the blocking of Le Pen and her dictator party

You couldn't make it up.

Again I'll say it, proportional representation. Everyone has a voice and that voice should be reflected in office.

All Labour are going to do is rile up those folks who want things to change here. THE BORDER BOATS ARE WORKING OVER TIME TODAY
His side kick Blair comes out the wood work, trying to pull strings
They are already colluding with the EU.
Starmer caught off camera, being told his eco policies will cost hundreds of billions of pounds, we don't have.
Starmer already panicking over Trump, as Republicans have done a dossier on Lammy after his comments. What a selection for foreign secretary, from anti white rants/ Trump/ white saviour comments undermining aid to Africa. Brilliant.
Troubles coming, just watch.

[Trickytreesreds]

Take your point about the support for Reform being ‘disturbing’, GP…but they do remain an ‘essentially one trick pony’ appealing to those who bleat on endlessly about immigration and small boats.

You’re right…the election results would have been very different without the impact of Reform on the traditional Tory vote, but their appeal is largely only to those who, like Tricky, wanted immigration to be the main General Election issue whereas actually what happened is, imo, that the cost of living, the NHS and the question of political integrity amongst our leaders proved to be the nation’s priorities.

Reform have nothing to offer on the major issues and I’d be surprised if Farage lasts long as MP for Clacton. He’ll welcome the salary but, as Swale has suggested, his narcissism and ego won’t allow the comparative anonymity and responsibility of being just another constituency MP.
I’d be surprised if he hasn’t moved on to another vanity project within the next 18 months.

Thats not true and you made yourself look quite uneducated there.
1. Immigration freeze on non essential immigration/ zero settlement for illegals/ foreign offenders deported
2. Big Tax breaks for small businesses
3.Royal commission to sort out social care
4. Scrap net zerp. The two have to work hand in hand. You cannot have growth without the right energy structure(price/amounts). We are cutting north sea gas just to import liquid gas from USA? WTF is that all about?
5.Divisive woke ideology in education sorted out
6. tax relief on schools to encourage more private education and relieve pressure
7.More money for NHS - The party sets out an extra £17bn a year for the NHS. That’s significantly higher spending than any of the three main parties. By 2028/29, the Conservative Party is pledging around £1bn extra in cash terms for the NHS, Labour around £2bn extra, and the Lib Dems £5.8bn extra.
8. Scrap the HS2 fiasco
9.Raising stamp duty to emcourage home buying and land lords
10. ECHR scrapped. Replaced with a UK bill of rights to stop an international court blocking things like terrorist removal


Immigration may be blocking your senses here RA, but maybe when Rayner satrts sending them to rural Derbyshire as well, you'll have a rethink. Housing isn't plentyful there for locals, wait till they get knocked back further

[Trickytreesreds]

I'm going to do a Swale now .
80% of the country didn't vote for Starmer, so that election should not count.

Same thing has happened in france, which is now ungovernable when you look at their ruling bodies.

No one seems to want to answer the question I keep posing on here.

WHY HAVE THE RIGHT RISEN ACROSS EUROPE?

The previous governments have to take a long look in the mirror.

Take the Tories, had they done Brexit right/protected the borders/ controlled immigration as it should. Then this last election would have looked so very different. Yes there were other issues, but the 4 M Reform VOTERS ALONE, were not the whole story. They also lost some to the other parties as a result.

Reform wouldn't exist today, had that happened and the Tory elite thinking it could ignore its own promises.

[Trickytreesreds]

What the Aussies think of France, all is lost and watch the fire works.

The French aren't noted for subtelty

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogPBfAvNcPs

[Ramshank72]

Actually, only 18,884 people voted for Kier, out of a voting population of approx 46,560,500... so 99.96% of the voting population did not vote for him.

[Trickytreesreds]

Actually, only 18,884 people voted for Kier, out of a voting population of approx 46,560,500... so 99.96% of the voting population did not vote for him.

very good,

Put in context, Labour polled 33% of that vote, the lowest amount ever for any single party majority government getting 410 seats. If that aint broken I don't know what is.

Using Swaleonomics

[MadAmster]

very good,

Put in context, Labour polled 33% of that vote, the lowest amount ever for any single party majority government getting 410 seats. If that aint broken I don't know what is.

Using Swaleonomics

That is, indeed the problem with FPTP elections. It won't, IMO, ever be implemented in the UK.

Lib Dems got 71 seats last week. IIRC, PR would have seen them get 62. Day after the election Davey said he's still in favour of it.

Tories might like the idea now.

Farridge certainly does.

2016 Starmer was in favour of it. I wonder if he still is?