Election Year or Fear!

[Trickytreesreds]

Unless kept out of GenPop, I don't see him lasting long. Either somebody who's already in there "forever" who wants the plaudits he'll get from other inmates or the lad's violent temperament will come to the fore and he'll have a go at someone and get put out of his mysery

Unless he serves his sentence in isolation, he will be attacked at some point. He murdered children and gloated about it. There will be a price on his head in many forms, from cash to drugs.
You cannot watch him round the clock, so expect a slashed throat or poisoned food find him.

[Geoff Parkstone]

If there was any natural justice in the country people like this should face the death penalty rather than await prison justice. And the victim's families could be given the option of "pressing the button" to effect this.

I'm not advocating that a widespread reintroduction of capital punishment should come in as there's no room for "oops we got that one wrong", but in clear cut cases like this why should I / we have to pay to keep this scum "on benefits" for the rest of his Allah given existence (other Gods are available).

[ramAnag]

The rioting was wholely on the part of the government and the police, hiding the truth from the public.
They claimed it wasn't a terror attack? Al Queda terror manuals, making ricin, 2019 to May 2022:

Police have several interactions with him, including responding to five calls from his home address relating to concerns about his behaviour. On each occasion, referrals are made to a multi-agency safeguarding hub.

Three referrals are also made by education providers to the Government anti-extremism scheme Prevent between December 2019 and April 2021.

He was aged between 13 and 14.

Then you have his father, who was allowed here by Blair, still has question marks hanging over him regarding Rwanda genocide.

Now factor in succesive governments reluctance to admit anything, Then Keir Starmer holding press conferences to condemn those suggesting any connection to Islam as ?Far Right?. Starmer knew of the ricin and Al-Qaeda manual found in Rudabukana?s home almost immediately after the search; and of the terror charges two weeks before the Crown Prosecution Service announced them'

Yet compare to this one- A knifeman with Adolf Hitler?s signature tattooed on his arm has been jailed for life for the attempted murder of an asylum seeker at a hotel, claiming the attack was a ?form of protest? against small boat crossings.

Callum Ulysses Parslow, who wrote his own ?terrorist manifesto?, stabbed Nahom Hagos in the chest and hand at the Pear Tree Inn at Hindlip, Worcestershire, in April last year after buying a ?specialist? knife online for 1,000 US dollars (?770). Declared a terrorist attack from the off!

There is a narrative here, that kicks in, when certain ethnicities and religious allegiace's raise their heads.

Had the government stepped up to the plate with simple facts, from day one, those riots could have been avoided.

They couldn't. It would have been sub judice and ultimately, contempt of court. He wasn’t motivated by Islam anymore than he was motivated by violence in general. He is a twisted kid who has an unhealthy obsession with violence - school massacres, acts of genocide etc. You may as well blame certain computer games as a religion.

Much has been made of the fact that he was expelled and went back to the school to attack someone with a hockey stick. Unfortunately such actions are not that uncommon, especially in schools dealing with poorer kids with more complex needs.
Much has also been made of the fact that he was able to buy a knife from Amazon, but honestly…so what? He could just as easily have taken such a weapon from his own kitchen. Homes, sheds and garages are full of potentially lethal weapons if they fall into the wrong hands and minds.

Of course the overriding question is, why? But we’ll probably never know. It’s like the killing of Jamie Bulger or the behaviour of Brady and Hindley…inexplicable rage and tragic madness which in no way ever justified the appalling violence, misinformation and rioting which followed.

[Geoff Parkstone]

"...justified the appalling violence, misinformation and rioting which followed."

an interesting perspective, and of course I agree that such rioting is never justifiable (except in extremes) BUT it has become the new "go to" response to most things where there is populist negativity toward particular things - eg BLM protests, pro palestinian or Israeli protests, just stop oil, the various anti capitalism protests to name a few. You name it, anyone have a problem with something, I know, lets riot and smash stuff up and maybe loot a bit of stuff too. We all have (or should have) an inalienable right to protest but its a question of how thats brought about - and particulalrly how social media stirs it up with misinformation and a ready "call to arms". Tiktok may be struggling to survive Trump and if he causes its dmise then at least something positive can come out of his election. Next Facebook and Xtwitter and the world will be a better place :-)

Feelings of course run high in thes Southport circumastances but notwithstanding the level of injustice there is very much an increased feeling of need to riot as the basic form of protest now. Not for todays protestors the gentle student marches of my youth where the inevitable end to the protest was in the pub over a few beers (Paris or Kent State excepted, but I was in Birmingham)

[SithHappens]

If there was any natural justice in the country people like this should face the death penalty rather than await prison justice. And the victim's families could be given the option of "pressing the button" to effect this.

I'm not advocating that a widespread reintroduction of capital punishment should come in as there's no room for "oops we got that one wrong", but in clear cut cases like this why should I / we have to pay to keep this scum "on benefits" for the rest of his Allah given existence (other Gods are available).

It makes you angry doesn't it. Its absolutely heart breaking what's happened, I can't imagine the horror those poor girls and the other victims , must have gone through.

I don't really support the death sentence, though cases like this test my resolve. I think probably the ideal result would be some big bruiser have hold of him and do the job we can't do.

If I'd heard he died in prison, yeah I think I'd think that's justice.

[ramAnag]

"...justified the appalling violence, misinformation and rioting which followed."

an interesting perspective, and of course I agree that such rioting is never justifiable (except in extremes) BUT it has become the new "go to" response to most things where there is populist negativity toward particular things - eg BLM protests, pro palestinian or Israeli protests, just stop oil, the various anti capitalism protests to name a few. You name it, anyone have a problem with something, I know, lets riot and smash stuff up and maybe loot a bit of stuff too. We all have (or should have) an inalienable right to protest but its a question of how thats brought about - and particulalrly how social media stirs it up with misinformation and a ready "call to arms". Tiktok may be struggling to survive Trump and if he causes its dmise then at least something positive can come out of his election. Next Facebook and Xtwitter and the world will be a better place :-)

Feelings of course run high in thes Southport circumastances but notwithstanding the level of injustice there is very much an increased feeling of need to riot as the basic form of protest now. Not for todays protestors the gentle student marches of my youth where the inevitable end to the protest was in the pub over a few beers (Paris or Kent State excepted, but I was in Birmingham)

Agreeing with much of that. I don’t really want to politicise such dreadful events any further than they already have been, but I honestly think the difference in this case is that the misinformation from certain quarters was specifically aimed at the alienation and targeting of certain ethnicities.

[SithHappens]

The only people responsible for the riots were the people who carried them out.

Attacking innocent people, no matter how angry you are, is totally unjustified and any punishment those involved have received is deserved.

[ramAnag]

The only people responsible for the riots were the people who carried them out.

Attacking innocent people, no matter how angry you are, is totally unjustified and any punishment those involved have received is deserved.

To an extent, yes. But there was a huge amount of misinformation put forward via social media and certain politicians claiming, amongst other things, that the perpetrator had recently arrived on a small boat. Given the political climate at the time we all know why and that, imo, is why social media is so dangerous. It mobilises dangerous half wits who don’t want to have their prejudices fact checked.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Isn't all misinformation targeting some objective or group or other? A bloke called Goebbels used it quite well and successive groups on all sides of the political spectrum have followed suit. Struggling to see why this example is any different, other than in your own particular mindset (that got spell checked to peculiar first time of writing).

[Trickytreesreds]

If there was any natural justice in the country people like this should face the death penalty rather than await prison justice. And the victim's families could be given the option of "pressing the button" to effect this.

I'm not advocating that a widespread reintroduction of capital punishment should come in as there's no room for "oops we got that one wrong", but in clear cut cases like this why should I / we have to pay to keep this scum "on benefits" for the rest of his Allah given existence (other Gods are available).

The death penalty should be on the table for a judge as an option. Even if it takes a committee to implement it. This animal doesn't deserve oxygen

[Trickytreesreds]

To an extent, yes. But there was a huge amount of misinformation put forward via social media and certain politicians claiming, amongst other things, that the perpetrator had recently arrived on a small boat. Given the political climate at the time we all know why and that, imo, is why social media is so dangerous. It mobilises dangerous half wits who don’t want to have their prejudices fact checked.

The media and government has hidden/ withheld loads to protect themselves in many situations, as well as this one. Starmer currently rund a 3 tier answer to all the countrys problems= 14 years of tory rule/ the black hole/ the far right. Its pathetic.
To label everyone far right who objects to mass immigration and the rise in knife crime/ *** crimes/ normal crimes/ terror attacks is an affront to every citizen with a free voice.

Watch this Sky news woman, react when the topic gets too close to the knuckle

https://www.facebook.com/share/r/155g2tyKRN/

[Trickytreesreds]

Its funny, how certain people are in jail for spreading hate on social media and Starmer calls it out.
Yet perhaps people under his nose need to be in jail as well?

Have folks forgotten this ?

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1628883/wes-streeting-abusive-tweets-labour-leadership-apologise-update

[ramAnag]

Isn't all misinformation targeting some objective or group or other? A bloke called Goebbels used it quite well and successive groups on all sides of the political spectrum have followed suit. Struggling to see why this example is any different, other than in your own particular mindset (that got spell checked to peculiar first time of writing).

Couldn’t agree more with your Goebbels comment, but many of the examples you introduced or the example of the Poll tax rioters didn’t involve misinformation and were targeting a cause rather than deliberately inciting mistrust/hatred of another ethnic/religious group.

[ramAnag]

Its funny, how certain people are in jail for spreading hate on social media and Starmer calls it out.
Yet perhaps people under his nose need to be in jail as well?

What’s funny, although in the circumstances that’s an entirely inappropriate word, is the way in which you shapeshift and deflect when you’re losing the argument.

On 29th October you wrote ‘So it was another Islam motivated crime then?’

Later the same day you added, ‘It is Islamic terrorism and the government/Police decided to hush it up.’

On 30th October you concluded, ‘that the rioters weren’t that far wrong in their anger…’

No, it wasn’t, it was the crazed and undeniably evil actions of a seriously maladjusted adolescent.

No, it wasn’t and no they didn’t. They couldn’t share what they knew at that time.

Yes they were. Nothing the rioters did helped at all and they were acting, at best, on the basis of malicious misinformation.

[Geoff Parkstone]

It makes you angry doesn't it. Its absolutely heart breaking what's happened, I can't imagine the horror those poor girls and the other victims , must have gone through.

I don't really support the death sentence, though cases like this test my resolve. I think probably the ideal result would be some big bruiser have hold of him and do the job we can't do.

If I'd heard he died in prison, yeah I think I'd think that's justice.

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