O/T:- ⚠️Impressed with the leadership [The UK Party Politics Thread]

[Mapperleypie]

The contortions that people get themselves into to defend this government are absolutely hilarious. You can see why they still hover around 40% in the opinion polls, it's like a strange cult where the evidence of experts is easily dismissed in favour of a three-word slogan.

'Freedom Day but don't bother doing some things' - didn't have quite the ring to it for Johnson to declare to much fanfare that he has somehow managed this pandemic well, hence the clubs are now open and spreading the virus. But fear not, by the end of September when the horse has well and truly bolted you will need a vaccine passport to attend.

[drillerpie]

The first part of your reply is an assumption driller, you may or may be right.

Do you honestly think as crazyfists suggests that 18 year olds and students haven’t been out for 18 months because that is not what I have seen?

You don’t think it is strange to assume that young people and students have no common sense. At what age does common sense arrive.

It's an assumption but a fairly solid one. Most European countries have kept stricter restrictions than the UK, and Labour has criticised the reopening.

In answer to your second question, I think your frontal lobe is fully developed at about 25 years old.

[seriouspie]

May I suggest that you and Elite relocate to Russia! - the government there enforce the laws quite well, you will be right at home.

Or better still Venezuela ..... the Socialists dream world where wealth is spread around so fairly by their compassionate and caring dictators.

[Elite_Pie]

Because they have a choice elite they don’t have to go to a nightclub, maybe I just believe in personal responsibility more than you do.

So, as an 18 year-old denied any sort of social life for well over a year, you would have decided to stay at home?

Give yourself a pat on the back for being soooooo responsible.

[forwardmagpie]

So, as an 18 year-old denied any sort of social life for well over a year, you would have decided to stay at home?

Give yourself a pat on the back for being soooooo responsible.

Now you are you being argumentative for the sake of it (ah it’s Elite so) no-one as far as I know iis denying people a social life (did a social live only start on the 19th July) but that doesn’t absolve people from taking care of themselves and others.

We are not at home we are on holiday in the UK but like most others we meet up with are taking some personal responsibility.

Do you take care of yourselves and others Elite?

[BigFatPie]

Some good points here on ‘personal responsibility’ . Why do we have driving laws, health and safety laws, child protection laws, race and s e x discrimination laws, and environmental laws when people could just take ‘personal responsibility’? That would work fantastically.

Look at the prime minister, there’s a man who’s always taken ‘personal responsibility’ for everything in his life and is an example to us all.

[Elite_Pie]

Now you are you being argumentative for the sake of it (ah it’s Elite so) no-one as far as I know iis denying people a social life (did a social live only start on the 19th July)?

Covid restrictions denied people a social life. Now the restrictions are being lifted some youngsters are taking advantage by going to a nightclub. Those youngsters have been branded 'idiots' and 'irresponsible' by some on here. That's unfair, but I think people in their sixties have forgotten that they didn't think like a 60 year old when they were 18.

Do you take care of yourselves and others Elite?

I try to follow the rules like most people do.

[magpie_mania]

Covid restrictions denied people a social life. Now the restrictions are being lifted some youngsters are taking advantage by going to a nightclub. Those youngsters have been branded 'idiots' and 'irresponsible' by some on here. That's unfair, but I think people in their sixties have forgotten that they didn't think like a 60 year old when they were 18.



I try to follow the rules like most people do.

'Because you can doesn't mean you should'.

Back to the speed limit. If the Government said that they were lifting the restriction and you can drive at whatever speed you want on a motorway, which would be more responsible - taking advantage a little of the new freedom and driving safely at 80 / 90 or hitting 150 and putting yourself and others at far greater risk?

Why can't nightclubs etc restrict numbers and use an online ticketing system? It's not hard and would save the huge queues and absolutely packed venues.

[drillerpie]

'Because you can doesn't mean you should'.

Back to the speed limit. If the Government said that they were lifting the restriction and you can drive at whatever speed you want on a motorway, which would be more responsible - taking advantage a little of the new freedom and driving safely at 80 / 90 or hitting 150 and putting yourself and others at far greater risk?

Why can't nightclubs etc restrict numbers and use an online ticketing system? It's not hard and would save the huge queues and absolutely packed venues.

In your opinion MM why doesn't the government remove speed limits and ask people just to be responsible?

[Mapperleypie]

Back to the speed limit. If the Government said that they were lifting the restriction and you can drive at whatever speed you want on a motorway, which would be more responsible - taking advantage a little of the new freedom and driving safely at 80 / 90 or hitting 150 and putting yourself and others at far greater risk?

I think you know as well as I do MM that in that scenario there would be people doing 150mph (AH springs to mind) that would put others lives at risk.

Where your action can directly put others lives at risk then sadly there need to be laws there to mitigate that.

The clubs are only open so Johnson could declare 'Freedom'. He could have legislated for capacity limits or a slower easing but chose not to as it did not fit his narrative. The blustering Worzel Gummidge tribute act could not give two shiny ones that it's potentially reckless, is likely to cause unnecessary deaths and that it will pit other people against each other.

[Elite_Pie]

Why can't nightclubs etc restrict numbers and use an online ticketing system?

I'm sure they could.

I think a gradual and controlled reopening of nightclubs might have been a good idea, but that wasn't what the government chose to do.

[magpie_mania]

So the Government are clearly irresponsible imo for making it personal responsibility.

Some club owners are irresponsible by allowing their premises to be packed.

Some of those attending are irresponsible by going to a place which is clearly unsafe.

Basically the buck stops with the Government, but the others play their part too.

The speeding illustration is very relevant.

[Elite_Pie]

So the Government are clearly irresponsible imo for making it personal responsibility.

Some club owners are irresponsible by allowing their premises to be packed.

Some of those attending are irresponsible by going to a place which is clearly unsafe.

Basically the buck stops with the Government, but the others play their part too.

I agree with your first line and part of the last, but not the middle two.

Line 2 - The club owners are only doing what they are allowed to do. They are not breaking any of the rules. After going so long with no income, I wouldn't blame them at all for trying to make up for lost time if it's within the rules.

Line 3 - You say "some of those attending are irresponsible by going to a place which is clearly unsafe". Some of them? So which ones are irresponsible and which ones aren't? If the place is clearly unsafe, why was it allowed to open in the way it did?

[BigFatPie]

I agree with your first line and part of the last, but not the middle two.

Line 2 - The club owners are only doing what they are allowed to do. They are not breaking any of the rules. After going so long with no income, I wouldn't blame them at all for trying to make up for lost time if it's within the rules.

Line 3 - You say "some of those attending are irresponsible by going to a place which is clearly unsafe". Some of them? So which ones are irresponsible and which ones aren't? If the place is clearly unsafe, why was it allowed to open in the way it did?

You’re expecting too much Elite. These clowns are now currently trying to renegotiate a treaty they signed to great acclaim 7 months ago. They made the bloke who negotiated it a lord.

And you seriously expect them to know what they’re doing with a deadly virus?? Haha.

[BanjoPie]

I rest my case your honour