Wimbledon post match reflections

[Brin]

I used to love this site it was full of debate and top posters who would argue, yes but would answer the question.

It?’s now like this totally oblivious to the question of his record stats but just spouts a load of ****e.
Not interesting in defending his record just interested in discrediting the poster.
I?’ve always been called a happy clapper and would never call for a managers head. The few on here that criticise the manager are met with sarcastic comments but very little evidence of his credentials apart from he?’s supposedly here to develop talent and sell for a profit. He?’s had injuries etc
His signings generally haven?’t been great. He says he?’s inherited issues but his better performers are players he hasn?’t signed. He says he will always thank the fans but goes straight down the tunnel unless we win which is rare. He says he will always communicate with the supporters but his latest interview about the length of contract is arrogant.
He had his 2 favoured forwards yesterday but we just hoofed it up top the first half which is awful to watch and has no effect.
We played better second half when YES WE CHANGED FORMATION.
We switched back and wow it didn?’t work.
I?’ve seen nothing to suggest he?’s got anything about him apart from relegation.
It?’s just smoke and mirrors.
This site is now full of posters who can not justify our league position or current form apart from injuries truth is they have no intention of trying to defend the record because they have nothing to offer.
He has set a new record in this league for us. Yet again no comment just criticism for the ones criticising him.
A once great site now home to as a recent poster described it as not worth the effort due to posters who are only interested in discrediting the poster and don?’t have much else to offer.
I?’m going to Exeter with 4 balanced loyal supporters who no longer post on here as it?’s now home to their words not mine the Hamshaw delusion community.
If I could advise the ones getting stick for criticising him I would give the site a swerve you are wasting your breath.

Nice to see you posting again pal. Missed you in the PL.

Hopefully you all have a great trip down and safe journey back from Exeter, alas I'm giving that one a miss due to other commitments.
I actually think we'll come away from there with something, unless Nombe is sold in the week.

[Heliosphan78]

I used to love this site it was full of debate and top posters who would argue, yes but would answer the question.

It’s now like this totally oblivious to the question of his record stats but just spouts a load of ****e.
Not interesting in defending his record just interested in discrediting the poster.
I’ve always been called a happy clapper and would never call for a managers head. The few on here that criticise the manager are met with sarcastic comments but very little evidence of his credentials apart from he’s supposedly here to develop talent and sell for a profit. He’s had injuries etc
His signings generally haven’t been great. He says he’s inherited issues but his better performers are players he hasn’t signed. He says he will always thank the fans but goes straight down the tunnel unless we win which is rare. He says he will always communicate with the supporters but his latest interview about the length of contract is arrogant.
He had his 2 favoured forwards yesterday but we just hoofed it up top the first half which is awful to watch and has no effect.
We played better second half when YES WE CHANGED FORMATION.
We switched back and wow it didn’t work.
I’ve seen nothing to suggest he’s got anything about him apart from relegation.
It’s just smoke and mirrors.
This site is now full of posters who can not justify our league position or current form apart from injuries truth is they have no intention of trying to defend the record because they have nothing to offer.
He has set a new record in this league for us. Yet again no comment just criticism for the ones criticising him.
A once great site now home to as a recent poster described it as not worth the effort due to posters who are only interested in discrediting the poster and don’t have much else to offer.
I’m going to Exeter with 4 balanced loyal supporters who no longer post on here as it’s now home to their words not mine the Hamshaw delusion community.
If I could advise the ones getting stick for criticising him I would give the site a swerve you are wasting your breath.

Tells me I'm talking ****e and then complains people are being discredited.

Do you think there's any Rotherham supporter who is happy with the run that we're on, or who is happy with some of the decisions the manager has made? Course not. He has to do better. And whilst results are obviously important, there are mitigating factors affecting results and also reasons to believe that sacking the manager won't make much difference. You might disagree and that's fine. It's called debate.

In my view, the manager is given the season and then a view taken at the end of it.

[Derbymiller]

I used to love this site it was full of debate and top posters who would argue, yes but would answer the question.

It?’s now like this totally oblivious to the question of his record stats but just spouts a load of ****e.
Not interesting in defending his record just interested in discrediting the poster.
I?’ve always been called a happy clapper and would never call for a managers head. The few on here that criticise the manager are met with sarcastic comments but very little evidence of his credentials apart from he?’s supposedly here to develop talent and sell for a profit. He?’s had injuries etc
His signings generally haven?’t been great. He says he?’s inherited issues but his better performers are players he hasn?’t signed. He says he will always thank the fans but goes straight down the tunnel unless we win which is rare. He says he will always communicate with the supporters but his latest interview about the length of contract is arrogant.
He had his 2 favoured forwards yesterday but we just hoofed it up top the first half which is awful to watch and has no effect.
We played better second half when YES WE CHANGED FORMATION.
We switched back and wow it didn?’t work.
I?’ve seen nothing to suggest he?’s got anything about him apart from relegation.
It?’s just smoke and mirrors.
This site is now full of posters who can not justify our league position or current form apart from injuries truth is they have no intention of trying to defend the record because they have nothing to offer.
He has set a new record in this league for us. Yet again no comment just criticism for the ones criticising him.
A once great site now home to as a recent poster described it as not worth the effort due to posters who are only interested in discrediting the poster and don?’t have much else to offer.
I?’m going to Exeter with 4 balanced loyal supporters who no longer post on here as it?’s now home to their words not mine the Hamshaw delusion community.
If I could advise the ones getting stick for criticising him I would give the site a swerve you are wasting your breath.

You are right this site has got toxic Enjoy the trip to Exeter hopefully it is on the back of a Tuesday win and a good performance, we need some good news and something to feel positive about at the moment.

[Brin]

You are right this site has got toxic Enjoy the trip to Exeter hopefully it is on the back of a Tuesday win and a good performance, we need some good news and something to feel positive about at the moment.

Derbs, where in Pocket's post does he say this site had got 'toxic'?

What you're reading of late on here and failing to respect even if you thing different are aspects/versions/opinions how everyone else sees the current situation at our club. Toxic is the wrong word and only aims to stir things up, give a rest please.

Out of a crowd of thousands, you'll never get 100% to all agree on everything such is life and human feelings.

[Derbymiller]

Really, I am the problem, unbelievable. He says the site contains people that only attack the poster, he uses the word discredit. This constant attacking the poster and not the issue is toxic. So I will give it a rest I will leave you and your little gang alone. Pathetic the lot of you

[Back of the net]

Tells me I'm talking ****e and then complains people are being discredited.

Do you think there's any Rotherham supporter who is happy with the run that we're on, or who is happy with some of the decisions the manager has made? Course not. He has to do better. And whilst results are obviously important, there are mitigating factors affecting results and also reasons to believe that sacking the manager won't make much difference. You might disagree and that's fine. It's called debate.

In my view, the manager is given the season and then a view taken at the end of it.

I think it’s called irony with the discrediting you to prove a point maybe?
I criticise the coach so for me I don't want people to agree with me. But the shutting down of criticism by some with no real counter argument is the frustrating bit.
I think it’s 4 points from 33 I may be wrong but it’s not acceptable and if people like me have a go about it then I’d like someone to tell me why I’m wrong apart from injuries, changing the manager solves nothing, we need a long term plan etc.

All the above can be valid but it doesn’t mean that the coach is anywhere near right for the job.
It’s a results business and up to this point he’s not getting them.

[PeteWaller]

I used to love this site it was full of debate and top posters who would argue, yes but would answer the question.

It’s now like this totally oblivious to the question of his record stats but just spouts a load of ****e.
Not interesting in defending his record just interested in discrediting the poster.
I’ve always been called a happy clapper and would never call for a managers head. The few on here that criticise the manager are met with sarcastic comments but very little evidence of his credentials apart from he’s supposedly here to develop talent and sell for a profit. He’s had injuries etc
His signings generally haven’t been great. He says he’s inherited issues but his better performers are players he hasn’t signed. He says he will always thank the fans but goes straight down the tunnel unless we win which is rare. He says he will always communicate with the supporters but his latest interview about the length of contract is arrogant.
He had his 2 favoured forwards yesterday but we just hoofed it up top the first half which is awful to watch and has no effect.
We played better second half when YES WE CHANGED FORMATION.
We switched back and wow it didn’t work.
I’ve seen nothing to suggest he’s got anything about him apart from relegation.
It’s just smoke and mirrors.
This site is now full of posters who can not justify our league position or current form apart from injuries truth is they have no intention of trying to defend the record because they have nothing to offer.
He has set a new record in this league for us. Yet again no comment just criticism for the ones criticising him.
A once great site now home to as a recent poster described it as not worth the effort due to posters who are only interested in discrediting the poster and don’t have much else to offer.
I’m going to Exeter with 4 balanced loyal supporters who no longer post on here as it’s now home to their words not mine the Hamshaw delusion community.
If I could advise the ones getting stick for criticising him I would give the site a swerve you are wasting your breath.

Hi Pocket!
Good to see you?re still around and I hope you?re well. Keep the faith mate, tough times perhaps but the sun will rise tomorrow. Coming to watch Harry Gray v Cardiff so looking forward to that. Hopefully not too much hoof ball coz that?s alien to him.
All the best mate

[Jocksgloves1]

Oh yes it’s now the fans fault. Booing is the main issue now.
Where is the MH millers mad cult tonight.
Surely you’ve all got loads to say about our dynamic play and the tactical genius.
No well what about the brilliant substitutions.
Come on tell us deluded idiots who dare to criticise were wrong.

Don't usually reply to posts on what is essentially a post-match thread. But...the players busted a gut to get a result and it was obvious at the end they were absolutely gutted. Then to be met with. Torrent of abuse from the 'fans' must have been like a kick in the whatsits.
Blame the manager for his limited choices of substitutions by all means, but did the team really deserve that?
It is , of course, my opinion as always.

[Townerslovechild]

Overall Saturday was a slight improvement, but still no where near good enough, for long enough, which has been the problem for most of the season.
Hopefully this is the start of another unbeaten run,with a few more wins,because realistically that's how we get out of this.
However, this won't be enough for some as they have had an issue with Hamshaw from the start for some reason.
Maybe he nicked their Monster Munch at school.

[UlleyMiller]

Overall Saturday was a slight improvement, but still no where near good enough, for long enough, which has been the problem for most of the season.
Hopefully this is the start of another unbeaten run,with a few more wins,because realistically that's how we get out of this.
However, this won't be enough for some as they have had an issue with Hamshaw from the start for some reason.
Maybe he nicked their Monster Munch at school.

I was at the same school, he wasn't nicking anyone's crisps.

[fivetide]

Ok so here's a question - everyone saying has to be 442 or 433, four at the back at least - does MH actually think he has the players for that? Maybe the brief period in that game we looked good he had the players he knew could do it. Perhaps, he reckons we'd be even worse trying 442 with different players?

He's said a big clear out coming, he's also made a few signings, any thinking that maybe he's signing the players we need to do that - or even more controversially, is trying to sign the players that will go with the formation he wants?

Don't most sides play 4231 or variations these days too? Looking up north for teams with little cash and focused on development, Falkirk (4231) put four past Hibs (3412) at the weekend with a lad they signed from a University side up front scoring a hat trick of tap ins. They look really good to watch playing out from the back. Be worth a look at the highlights.

[UlleyMiller]

Ok so here's a question - everyone saying has to be 442 or 433, four at the back at least - does MH actually think he has the players for that? Maybe the brief period in that game we looked good he had the players he knew could do it. Perhaps, he reckons we'd be even worse trying 442 with different players?

He's said a big clear out coming, he's also made a few signings, any thinking that maybe he's signing the players we need to do that - or even more controversially, is trying to sign the players that will go with the formation he wants?

Don't most sides play 4231 or variations these days too? Looking up north for teams with little cash and focused on development, Falkirk (4231) put four past Hibs (3412) at the weekend with a lad they signed from a University side up front scoring a hat trick of tap ins. They look really good to watch playing out from the back. Be worth a look at the highlights.

Not speaking on behalf of others, but it feels to me like the frustration (the genuine one, not the noise from the trolls) is that he's not changing it at all. Decent L1 players should be able to operate in two or three different systems without much fuss, but Hamshaw seems frustratingly reluctant to change it despite it looking like being one of the major reasons we're down in 23rd.

It looks like the plan is to continue to bring the average age down (fully support this) and to develop players rather than gamble on older pro's who've 'done it' before (support this also), but the formation should adapt to the available players and the opposition, not to be part of the club identity irrespective of everything else.

As the season has gone on, it's become clear that whatever else we're dealing with, we normally have two centre backs available (mostly, although a couple of games we didn't have that), and two able to play full back. Whether it's 442, 451, 433, 4141, the back 4 is the bit we can fill properly. Next season, if MH is here, who knows, maybe he signs players suited to a 3... but for all the positives a back 3 may give, a back 4 will always unlock more options with the rest of the system.

[fivetide]

Not speaking on behalf of others, but it feels to me like the frustration (the genuine one, not the noise from the trolls) is that he's not changing it at all. Decent L1 players should be able to operate in two or three different systems without much fuss, but Hamshaw seems frustratingly reluctant to change it despite it looking like being one of the major reasons we're down in 23rd.

It looks like the plan is to continue to bring the average age down (fully support this) and to develop players rather than gamble on older pro's who've 'done it' before (support this also), but the formation should adapt to the available players and the opposition, not to be part of the club identity irrespective of everything else.

As the season has gone on, it's become clear that whatever else we're dealing with, we normally have two centre backs available (mostly, although a couple of games we didn't have that), and two able to play full back. Whether it's 442, 451, 433, 4141, the back 4 is the bit we can fill properly. Next season, if MH is here, who knows, maybe he signs players suited to a 3... but for all the positives a back 3 may give, a back 4 will always unlock more options with the rest of the system.

Some good and sensible points.

Agree, average age down and there is a chance some loan players will or could stay, we've seen that before if they feel settled and are hungry for game time.

So if we can sort of fill the back 4, what goes in front? Do we have the Arnie to run it out the back or play the killer pass to midfield? Do we have a Kevin Watson to spread the play wide? Do we have the buzzing forward to keep a defence occupied and create space between the lines? For 433 do we have the wide players capable of coming back to defend all the time and fill holes in the midfield? Or even someone who is a real ball winner in the middle who can run with it like Rathbone? That sort of thing. We have players but collectively, can they make a decent team? And i get a team of good players can be a terrible team. MH job has to be to make us more than the sum of our parts.

[UlleyMiller]

Some good and sensible points.

Agree, average age down and there is a chance some loan players will or could stay, we've seen that before if they feel settled and are hungry for game time.

So if we can sort of fill the back 4, what goes in front? Do we have the Arnie to run it out the back or play the killer pass to midfield? Do we have a Kevin Watson to spread the play wide? Do we have the buzzing forward to keep a defence occupied and create space between the lines? For 433 do we have the wide players capable of coming back to defend all the time and fill holes in the midfield? Or even someone who is a real ball winner in the middle who can run with it like Rathbone? That sort of thing. We have players but collectively, can they make a decent team? And i get a team of good players can be a terrible team. MH job has to be to make us more than the sum of our parts.

We have Spence next season who can be a solid CDM, but I don't know what the plan is for those around him. I guess the division we're in, how much we can spend, etc will play a part in whether that's another loanee like Gore (Gore and Spence would both offer comfort for a back 4), or if we look at two 'old fashioned' midfielders who operate left and right as part of a 3. Guesswork as to how we'd approach it because there are so many unknowns.

Personally I'd love nothing more than to commit a sizeable chunk to getting Gore on a permanent, but I don't know if 1) we'd be comfortable parting with (likely) a million quid for a centre mid, 2) he'd want to stay, or 3) if we'd be in L1 (L2 would be a non-starter).

[RU66]

No matter what formation you play League One is route 1 football need to get the heart of your side strong. Dawson centre backs get in but we have no holding player in midfield or a big forward. Gore Spence together could do that job in centre mid as long as one stays back.