Bartley

Two, maybe three seasons back Bartley has a very good season and scored some important goals at important times. After a number of managers coming and going, he certainly has had a poor season thus far. He seemed more confident on the ball yesterday and took the goal very well indeed. Made some very good interceptions throughout yesterday's game and was still in the thick of it by the ninety fifth minute.
If he has responded to this criticism like this, then the new manager is having an effect already, in the area most weakest, noticeably our mental strength.
The fact that nobody is a shoe in perhaps, is concentrating minds.

It will take more than one game to convince me.
Best period for us was under Big Sam for month or two that’s it
His constant gesticulation at other players and poor performances under Bilic meant he was not a regular under bilic.
Since relegation he’s been a liability.
I’m of the opinion like other senior players (Livermore and Phillips) that they know deep down promotion will see them out of the door. They have achieved what can be expected of them, they played at the top level, job done.

They are quite content to cruise out the last few years of their careers and who knows maybe get another extension if they put some effort in!.
Problem is what they anticipated as an easy gig is actually al lot tougher than they thought. Hey they are even getting dropped, better try a little harder then.

As for other defenders,
O’Shea , determined warrior like him a lot BUT sadly not a great defender
Ajaji, competitive, ambitious lots of pace, but concentration is a problem. Still our best defender.

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Originally Posted by saltnshake

The simple fact is Bartley, Livermore and Johnstone when he was here, no matter how they played come in for more criticism than any other players no matter what happened, although I'm sure you will provide evidence to the contrary😊.

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The general saltiness of your response leaves me unshaken Shakey as I agree that Bartley, Livermore and Johnstone have indeed come in for more stick than was strictly necessary at times.

As such I really can't be bothered providing evidence to the contrary by compiling a list of players who have also come in for stick with a count of posting numbers. That doesn't mean your post preceding this one wasn't utter b@ll@cks 😊 .

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Originally Posted by mickd1961

O’Shea doesn’t escape my criticism Salt......I think he’s a very poor player.

No pace, too short and poor positional sense.

For me he has the major trait of every poor defender, he’s always on the stretch, he makes everything look like hard work.

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That's it in a nutshell really. Prior to his injury he did have some good games for us and demonstrated lots of energy and competitiveness. Since then too much of his play has been sloppy but, over all, I agree with you. Good defenders always look solid and comfortable as well as being very aware positionally but Dara is one of those who too often looks over-stretched. Hopefully Corberan can get him to improve in these areas but he's never going to be a Statham.

It's always amazing how average centre halves can look quite decent when they are properly protected. Bartley and O'Shea are ok but they've been exposed all season by the lack of tactics under Bruce and the poor quality ahead of them and next to them.

We look much better now with Okay back in the team as part of a three man middle.

Bartley is good at heading and tackling, if he is asked to do those things he is fine but if you over complicate his game and ask him to play out the back you are asking for trouble,, will often find it from him.

He had his best performances for us under fat Sam, who had him doing those things he is good at at the highest level consistently.

So it's too early to see how CC wants him to play, although at present it is to his simple strengths.

He had a good game yesterday but, it still had moments where he made silly errors when having to play the simplest of passes.

I certainly wouldn't be offering him a new contract yet.

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Originally Posted by BaggieBlood

Bartley is good at heading and tackling, if he is asked to do those things he is fine but if you over complicate his game and ask him to play out the back you are asking for trouble,, will often find it from him.

He had his best performances for us under fat Sam, who had him doing those things he is good at at the highest level consistently.

So it's too early to see how CC wants him to play, although at present it is to his simple strengths.

He had a good game yesterday but, it still had moments where he made silly errors when having to play the simplest of passes.

I certainly wouldn't be offering him a new contract yet.

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Spot on BB buddy.
Notwithstanding the flak I given him, I really want to congratulate his positives, as outlined by you. Keep it simple and avoid the constant pointing and directing. Just do the basic defensive stuff Kyle.

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Originally Posted by baggiematt

It's always amazing how average centre halves can look quite decent when they are properly protected. Bartley and O'Shea are ok but they've been exposed all season by the lack of tactics under Bruce and the poor quality ahead of them and next to them.

We look much better now with Okay back in the team as part of a three man middle.

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100% he is asked to do a simpler job and as you say is protected more, it isn’t rocket science.

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Originally Posted by baggiematt

It's always amazing how average centre halves can look quite decent when they are properly protected. Bartley and O'Shea are ok but they've been exposed all season by the lack of tactics under Bruce and the poor quality ahead of them and next to them.

We look much better now with Okay back in the team as part of a three man middle.

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Completely agree.

Remember Lescott? Looked pretty solid for us with Mulumbu and Yacob in front of him. Went to Villa and helped get them relegated because he was so exposed. Same defender, just a different team set up made him look woeful.

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Originally Posted by WBA123

Completely agree.

Remember Lescott? Looked pretty solid for us with Mulumbu and Yacob in front of him. Went to Villa and helped get them relegated because he was so exposed. Same defender, just a different team set up made him look woeful.

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Lescott was terrible in his second season for us though.

Remember when Megson brought in Port Vale reserve centre half Buttler back in 2000?

Megson said he couldn’t pass a ball 5 yards but what he could do was win every corner and cross in the air and block as if his life depended on it!

He did and along with Clement, Cummings and the returning Bob Taylor he helped keep us up.

A hero of mine, long forgotten by many but superb at the basics.