Death Row Deaths.

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Originally Posted by The Bedlington Terrier

Speaking of barbaric barbarians...

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/crime...87019676d88872

Disgusting hardly gets near it, does it?

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I've told you before BT, nobody ever gets anything right first time these days.
A good musician would have got it right and played him a tune while he was at it.

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Originally Posted by Swissclaret

Sydney Silverman, MP for Nelson, was one of the great supporters of abolishing capital punishment. This had been debated for a long time.

One of the drivers was the conviction of Craig and Bentley in, I think, 1952 for the shooting of a Police Officer. This was unheard of then.

One fired the gun. The other shouted «*Let him have it*». The debate for many years was whether or not he was encouraging the other to shoot (and therefore guilty) or encouraging the other to let the Police Officer have the gun. The jury found him guilty and he hanged.

Ignoring the concept of «*unreasonable*» the view became that it is better that a guilty person go free than than an innocent one is put to death.

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These issues have of course been previously debated on these pages Swiss. Doubtless our legal studies have had a great bearing on our views on capital punishment.

Quote Originally Posted by 1959_60 View Post
[B]




Hanging was an issue that divided the country. It was finally abolished in 1969 after many years of argy bargy from both sides.
There is a move by some Tory MP's to bring hanging back. If there were to be a referendum on it, and it was passed, then I for one (and I suspect Labour and the Lib Dems) would campaign strongly for it's abolition once again.
But we would not be "going to arbitrarily cancel 17.4 million votes and overturn it." That is complete nonsense and you know it.
But we would strongly campaign for it's abolition - which has been normal practice in a democracy since the year dot.
The cause for abolition was given much additional weight by three particular cases. The hanging of Timothy Evans for the crimes committed by John Reginald Christie; the hanging of Ruth Ellis who murdered her sometimes violent lover when public opinion was strongly against the death penalty in the circumstances of her case;and finally the hanging of Derek Bentley for the murder of a police officer by his accomplice Chris Craig who at 16 was himself too young to be sentenced to death.

Public opinion has no doubt shifted in recent years because of the vile and repulsive deeds by Al-Qaeda and ISIS amongst others. I am yet to be convinced about the merits or otherwise of the re-introduction of capital punishment.

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Originally Posted by Supersub6

I've told you before BT, nobody ever gets anything right first time these days.
A good musician would have got it right and played him a tune while he was at it.

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Never had you down for a person who would delight in mob justice mein freund. :(

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Originally Posted by outwoodclaret

These issues have of course been previously debated on these pages Swiss. Doubtless our legal studies have had a great bearing on our views on capital punishment.

Quote Originally Posted by 1959_60 View Post
[B]




Hanging was an issue that divided the country. It was finally abolished in 1969 after many years of argy bargy from both sides.
There is a move by some Tory MP's to bring hanging back. If there were to be a referendum on it, and it was passed, then I for one (and I suspect Labour and the Lib Dems) would campaign strongly for it's abolition once again.
But we would not be "going to arbitrarily cancel 17.4 million votes and overturn it." That is complete nonsense and you know it.
But we would strongly campaign for it's abolition - which has been normal practice in a democracy since the year dot.
The cause for abolition was given much additional weight by three particular cases. The hanging of Timothy Evans for the crimes committed by John Reginald Christie; the hanging of Ruth Ellis who murdered her sometimes violent lover when public opinion was strongly against the death penalty in the circumstances of her case;and finally the hanging of Derek Bentley for the murder of a police officer by his accomplice Chris Craig who at 16 was himself too young to be sentenced to death.

Public opinion has no doubt shifted in recent years because of the vile and repulsive deeds by Al-Qaeda and ISIS amongst others. I am yet to be convinced about the merits or otherwise of the re-introduction of capital punishment.

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Much better to incarcerate convicted offenders in maximum, high security jails to keep "society safe" rather than kill them and find out after the event they were innocent after all eh Sir Outwood?

I have no objection in principal to the death penalty, it's my view that if anyone takes another life, their own should be forfeit. However this assumes the justice system is to be trusted and relied upon to reach a safe and certain verdict in every case, which it can't and it won't, so I would never support the re-introduction of the death penalty.

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Originally Posted by sinkov

I have no objection in principal to the death penalty, it's my view that if anyone takes another life, their own should be forfeit. However this assumes the justice system is to be trusted and relied upon to reach a safe and certain verdict in every case, which it can't and it won't, so I would never support the re-introduction of the death penalty.

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The voice of reason at long last. I knew you had it in you mon ami. >:)

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Originally Posted by Supersub6

I've told you before BT, nobody ever gets anything right first time these days.
A good musician would have got it right and played him a tune while he was at it.

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Originally Posted by The Bedlington Terrier

Never had you down for a person who would delight in mob justice mein freund. :(

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BT, where did I say that I supported anything? I said that nobody gets anything right first time -----very few do, whereas a musician would get it right and, because of their skill could play a tune while doing the job ---fact of life.
As normal, i have no control over what the American justice system does, therefore, I don't worry about it or mount any campaigns ----why waste time and energy?

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Originally Posted by Supersub6

BT, where did I say that I supported anything? I said that nobody gets anything right first time -----very few do, whereas a musician would get it right and, because of their skill could play a tune while doing the job ---fact of life.
As normal, i have no control over what the American justice system does, therefore, I don't worry about it or mount any campaigns ----why waste time and energy?

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I'll bet the poor bugger strapped on the gurney does not share your self-righteous apathy Supersub6.

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Originally Posted by The Bedlington Terrier

I'll bet the poor bugger strapped on the gurney does not share your self-righteous apathy Supersub6.

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Possibly not, however, unlike him, I have never killed anybody, in spite of being in the military for 23 years and being trained to do so, neither have I been in prison. He chose to do what he did, nobody forced him and, as I previously said, I have no jurisdiction over any of this so I will not worry. Not a difficult decision to make at all. In this particular case ---Apathy Rules OK.
I have to dash because I am joining a 'No To Oil' demonstration.

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Originally Posted by outwoodclaret

These issues have of course been previously debated on these pages Swiss. Doubtless our legal studies have had a great bearing on our views on capital punishment.

Quote Originally Posted by 1959_60 View Post
[B]




Hanging was an issue that divided the country. It was finally abolished in 1969 after many years of argy bargy from both sides.
There is a move by some Tory MP's to bring hanging back. If there were to be a referendum on it, and it was passed, then I for one (and I suspect Labour and the Lib Dems) would campaign strongly for it's abolition once again.
But we would not be "going to arbitrarily cancel 17.4 million votes and overturn it." That is complete nonsense and you know it.
But we would strongly campaign for it's abolition - which has been normal practice in a democracy since the year dot.
The cause for abolition was given much additional weight by three particular cases. The hanging of Timothy Evans for the crimes committed by John Reginald Christie; the hanging of Ruth Ellis who murdered her sometimes violent lover when public opinion was strongly against the death penalty in the circumstances of her case;and finally the hanging of Derek Bentley for the murder of a police officer by his accomplice Chris Craig who at 16 was himself too young to be sentenced to death.

Public opinion has no doubt shifted in recent years because of the vile and repulsive deeds by Al-Qaeda and ISIS amongst others. I am yet to be convinced about the merits or otherwise of the re-introduction of capital punishment.

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I agree Outwood. I am sure that we could both write a thesis on this subject. There is both the jurisprudential perspective as well as the moral perspective. Throw into that the subjective decisions of a human jury and it is a recipe for almost permanent debate.

One element that I do not agree with is the focus on the accused and their rights compared with the victim and the victim’s family who are too often overlooked by the liberal brigade.