Who claims Rafa's style is negative

[pboromag]

Yes that squad those days didn't cost much, neither did the club as I believe SJH paid about £12 million for it a few months before the entertainers.

But the whole thing is relative. i.e. There were the likes of Shearer, Ferdinand and Beardsley then. How much would they cost in today's market.

You couldn't put a price on them now.

Also you are drooling over Watford's style of play but if Rafa had been buying players from Watford you would have been slagging him off.

Just let the man do his job. Safety first until we establish in the Premiership. Then depending on how honest Ashley is with his ambition, and he's welshed on promises to managers before, let's see what team Rafa can build and what style of play we will see from him when he gets his RIGHT TEAM on the pitch.

what he paid then to now has no relevance to setting a team up in a negative way

it is completly immaterial

rafa could pay 140 mill or 4 mill for a player
if he then makes that player play in a negative formation the style of play is negative

kk didnt go out and buy expensive players in the main
what he did was play those players in a positive formation

very much like watford have started and a few others

even wba play a much more positive way than they did a few seasons ago

i dont think that anyone except someone who is brewing for an argument by twisting the thread would say rafas tactics are positive

he plays 1 up front will make subs but keep 1 up front even when we are loosing .to me that is negative footy
just an opinion

negative footy and psoitive results are two different things

[ex_pat_magpie]

what he paid then to now has no relevance to setting a team up in a negative way

it is completly immaterial

rafa could pay 140 mill or 4 mill for a player
if he then makes that player play in a negative formation the style of play is negative

kk didnt go out and buy expensive players in the main
what he did was play those players in a positive formation

very much like watford have started and a few others

even wba play a much more positive way than they did a few seasons ago

i dont think that anyone except someone who is brewing for an argument by twisting the thread would say rafas tactics are positive

he plays 1 up front will make subs but keep 1 up front even when we are loosing .to me that is negative footy
just an opinion

negative footy and psoitive results are two different things

Pboro Please don't get twisted and warped. No one to use your own words

"is brewing for an argument by twisting the thread would say rafas tactics are positive"

And talking about "twisting for an argument by twisting threads" No one on this board has done this more than yourself by your continuous ranting and ravings against one of the world's most successful coaches.

How's this for a record.

He is the only manager in history to have won the UEFA Europa League, UEFA Super Cup, UEFA Champions League and the FIFA Club World Cup.

How many coaches/managers in the world have come close to this.

All it is, is a difference of opinion between yourself and the rest of the board who have different opinions.

I am convinced that Rafa will play a more attacking style the more safer we are in the division

[NorthernRock]

I see Peterborough's points, I agree with your view on attacking footy, that's what I want to see too BUT Bill's right though, the games changed MASSIVELY, you try and attack teams in this league and you'll get pissed all over...

We've got to build slowly and the more we improve our playing squad the more you'll see Rafa adapt the way he sets his team up, I'm sure.

As Toptoon said, you've got to play to your strengths and Rafa is building a solid team, it's a results business... Just look at your mate De Boer, an excellent coaching/ethos pedigree and tbf they do have some talent but it failed miserably...

Also you mentioned the likes of Neilsson, Bracewell, Sellers etc but in 96 we had a ****ing good team and it WOULD cost a fortune now..

Ginola was bought from PSG for £2.5m? How much would they want for a winger of his quality now? LOL...

Ferdinand another 6m player who scored regularly... Wood cost £15m and he couldn't lace big les's boots man.

Gillespie would STILL be one of the best right wingers in the league on his day...

Batty was a 4m signing from leeds and apart from Keane I'd say he was one of the best DM's in the league.

Barton was a 4m signing from Wimbledon and I'm pretty sure he was the most expensive defender in the league at that time you know, so you'd be looking at atleast £20m now mate

Albert was **** hot, Belgium were ****e back then and he still cost around 4m so again you'd be looking at atleast 20m for a ball playing defender of his standard.

Then there's Asprilla, Lee and Beardsley... Attack minded players who were full of quality and regardless of price comparable to the very best in the league.

I'm a firm believer that a player's quality is not determined by price, but it is harder to find them now and it's going to take time to build the team, he's restricted tbf so I'm sure he'll be eying several windows and a good season back in the Prem before he starts attempting to dominate teams rather than 5 games and 1 window tbh.

There's so many variables but at the end of the day KK had top dollar to spend back then and in todays market as Bill said you'd be looking at around £250m to assemble that squad, without any doubt.

At the end of the day, you're right with what you're saying about it shouldn't matter about the quality of players, if they go out there and play attacking football but in reality unless you've got the right amount of quality you can't sustain it over a full game never mind a season, you need to be pragmatic at times and I believe we have one of the best tacticians in the business, I really do, it's far more intricate than just saying "go out there and attack them lads".

I think we've got the basis of a solid team and I truly believe that once he gets the players he needs/wants then you'll see more attacking intent... Although I'd go back to Bills original points about us having one of the best away records in the past year and our number of attempts at goal...

Patience is key, we're building from the back and that's a very sensible approach considering that we've just been promoted.

Bit by bit we'll get there, I'm appreciating what we DO have rather than what we don't at the minute tbh.

[pboromag]

I see Peterborough's points, I agree with your view on attacking footy, that's what I want to see too BUT Bill's right though, the games changed MASSIVELY, you try and attack teams in this league and you'll get pissed all over...

We've got to build slowly and the more we improve our playing squad the more you'll see Rafa adapt the way he sets his team up, I'm sure.

As Toptoon said, you've got to play to your strengths and Rafa is building a solid team, it's a results business... Just look at your mate De Boer, an excellent coaching/ethos pedigree and tbf they do have some talent but it failed miserably...

Also you mentioned the likes of Neilsson, Bracewell, Sellers etc but in 96 we had a ****ing good team and it WOULD cost a fortune now..

Ginola was bought from PSG for £2.5m? How much would they want for a winger of his quality now? LOL...

Ferdinand another 6m player who scored regularly... Wood cost £15m and he couldn't lace big les's boots man.

Gillespie would STILL be one of the best right wingers in the league on his day...

Batty was a 4m signing from leeds and apart from Keane I'd say he was one of the best DM's in the league.

Barton was a 4m signing from Wimbledon and I'm pretty sure he was the most expensive defender in the league at that time you know, so you'd be looking at atleast £20m now mate

Albert was **** hot, Belgium were ****e back then and he still cost around 4m so again you'd be looking at atleast 20m for a ball playing defender of his standard.

Then there's Asprilla, Lee and Beardsley... Attack minded players who were full of quality and regardless of price comparable to the very best in the league.

I'm a firm believer that a player's quality is not determined by price, but it is harder to find them now and it's going to take time to build the team, he's restricted tbf so I'm sure he'll be eying several windows and a good season back in the Prem before he starts attempting to dominate teams rather than 5 games and 1 window tbh.

There's so many variables but at the end of the day KK had top dollar to spend back then and in todays market as Bill said you'd be looking at around £250m to assemble that squad, without any doubt.

At the end of the day, you're right with what you're saying about it shouldn't matter about the quality of players, if they go out there and play attacking football but in reality unless you've got the right amount of quality you can't sustain it over a full game never mind a season, you need to be pragmatic at times and I believe we have one of the best tacticians in the business, I really do, it's far more intricate than just saying "go out there and attack them lads".

I think we've got the basis of a solid team and I truly believe that once he gets the players he needs/wants then you'll see more attacking intent... Although I'd go back to Bills original points about us having one of the best away records in the past year and our number of attempts at goal...

Patience is key, we're building from the back and that's a very sensible approach considering that we've just been promoted.

Bit by bit we'll get there, I'm appreciating what we DO have rather than what we don't at the minute tbh.

city attack arsenal attack man ure attack the baggies ahve started to attack,chelse attack ,spuds paly attacking footy
i dont see them getting stuffed

you are right they would cost a fortune but they didnt then and if we found players like we did then and set them up with a kk style of manager we would probabaly end up selling them again

kk didnt spend top dollar on the majority of his players ,what he did do was attack ,every team hates being attacked for 90 minutes

as much as i didnt like kk second time around
i reckon with his attacking philosophy he would make a great manager today in the prem

[NorthernRock]

city attack arsenal attack man ure attack the baggies ahve started to attack,chelse attack ,spuds paly attacking footy
i dont see them getting stuffed

you are right they would cost a fortune but they didnt then and if we found players like we did then and set them up with a kk style of manager we would probabaly end up selling them again

kk didnt spend top dollar on the majority of his players ,what he did do was attack ,every team hates being attacked for 90 minutes

as much as i didnt like kk second time around
i reckon with his attacking philosophy he would make a great manager today in the prem

You've answered my point though- City, Arsenal and ManU all have top expensive teams and they're challenging for the title/CL.. And WBA the same team that got spanked by probably the weakest team in the division?... **** off man

You say we've got a **** team and manager but you're comparing us to CL teams??

You'll know there's things called inflation, relativity and market value right?

KK was spending top dollar THEN mate, I haven't got stats but I'd bet we were one of the highest spenders in the league by the time the season finished.

Barton was one of the most expensive defenders at the time (pretty sure the most) you compare that fee to £50 for Kyle Walker, they're both record English right-backs.

How many teams attack for 90 mins now though? The competition has changed a huge amount, it's much more tactic based and the competition has improved massively, City were getting relegated and had a pretty poor team when we were challenging in 96... Remember Kinkladze though...

We were the "swashbuckling" team of 96 and set a precedence but Manchester scored more goals than us and actually won the league, that doesn't tell the full story but that's what history will tell you.

KK did an amazing job and I'll always rate him in ways but tbh mate you can't really say if he would or wouldn't for definite because of how the competition has changed and his supposed lack of tactical awareness, in a similar situation to Rafa he actually walked out because of how he thought he'd need a big kitty to compete (and being undermined), he realised he couldn't have relative to what he had back then to play his ball, 2nd time round we were nowhere near as attacking... why? Because he didn't have his 96 team... You can't really compare our team from 96 to give a fair comparison to your point tbh.