O/T:- Mr George Floyd RIP

[KCNotts]

The problem is, these protestors are not just putting their own lives at risk by ignoring social distancing. They have families who they will return home to and pass on the virus to. As a teacher, I shall go back to work tomorrow to face a room full of 15 children. We can't social distance properly in a small classroom. Were any of their parents or siblings at the protests? The same can be said for lots of people being exposed to the virus in workplaces around the country.

Whereas I feel strongly that racism in all forms is abhorrent, it is not clear to me what these protestors want. They shout lots of slogans picked up on social media, but what are they actually protesting for? To raise awareness? I'd suggest that the very sight of thousands of people ignoring government warnings and putting people at risk is just adding fuel to a racist's fire. They won't change a racist's viewpoint in this way.

They only way to make change is to vote for politicians who care. How many of the people protesting in the streets voted for Johnson and his racist friends? We put a known racist in power.

If people want change...vote for it next time.

[maddogslater]

The problem is, these protestors are not just putting their own lives at risk by ignoring social distancing. They have families who they will return home to and pass on the virus to. As a teacher, I shall go back to work tomorrow to face a room full of 15 children. We can't social distance properly in a small classroom. Were any of their parents or siblings at the protests? The same can be said for lots of people being exposed to the virus in workplaces around the country.

Whereas I feel strongly that racism in all forms is abhorrent, it is not clear to me what these protestors want. They shout lots of slogans picked up on social media, but what are they actually protesting for? To raise awareness? I'd suggest that the very sight of thousands of people ignoring government warnings and putting people at risk is just adding fuel to a racist's fire. They won't change a racist's viewpoint in this way.

They only way to make change is to vote for politicians who care. How many of the people protesting in the streets voted for Johnson and his racist friends? We put a known racist in power.

If people want change...vote for it next time.

An intelligent post, spot on.

[BigFatPie]

The problem is, these protestors are not just putting their own lives at risk by ignoring social distancing. They have families who they will return home to and pass on the virus to. As a teacher, I shall go back to work tomorrow to face a room full of 15 children. We can't social distance properly in a small classroom. Were any of their parents or siblings at the protests? The same can be said for lots of people being exposed to the virus in workplaces around the country.

Whereas I feel strongly that racism in all forms is abhorrent, it is not clear to me what these protestors want. They shout lots of slogans picked up on social media, but what are they actually protesting for? To raise awareness? I'd suggest that the very sight of thousands of people ignoring government warnings and putting people at risk is just adding fuel to a racist's fire. They won't change a racist's viewpoint in this way.

They only way to make change is to vote for politicians who care. How many of the people protesting in the streets voted for Johnson and his racist friends? We put a known racist in power.

If people want change...vote for it next time.

I agree with the general sentiment of your post. However I’m white, and not on the receiving end of racism, so I would be hesitant to try to tell BAME people and others when it’s right or wrong to protest about racism.

[KCNotts]

I agree with the general sentiment of your post. However I’m white, and not on the receiving end of racism, so I would be hesitant to try to tell BAME people and others when it’s right or wrong to protest about racism.

Yes that's a fair point. I lived in an Asian country for seven years so I can appreciate what it feels like to be in the minority and the casual racism that comes with it. Of course it does grind you down. Clearly we are at boiling point, which is unsurprising. The world is a complete mess.

I just feel that these protests are happening at the worst time (although I appreciate the reasons why) and maybe if the message was more coherent, they may be a little less divisive. Unfortunately these things also attract idiots who detract from any message by throwing bikes at horses. The violence is doing nobody any favours.

[Old_pie]

I don't understand where your mind is here Oldpie. You're comparing the 'mistreatment' of a live human being to that of a statue to start with. As BFP says your comparisons are off the scale.

To be clear no-one is saying we need to erase history. But I think it's time to get rid of the art on our street on public streets that glorifies the really nasty parts of British colonial history. It looks like Edward Colston's business was responsible for enslaving and shipping over 80,000 men, women and children from Africa to the UK. You might be prepared to overlook that because of the 'good things he did'. But I find that train of thought unacceptable and can't imagine anything good he could do that would overcome what he did to those 80,000 people and their families descendents.

Honestly what you're saying it's not a million miles away from saying they shouldn't have taken down the Jimmy Saville statues and plaques in Glasgow and Scarborough because he did a lot for charity too.

Which bits of history should we keep? We have a chequered past. Cenotaph attacked too. Should the Catholics rise again against the monarchy? And with whom was Colston doing the trading of slaves? Some Africans were getting very rich just as they had from the days of the Romans. Let's burn Rome.

Saville was doing stuff under our noses when the law at the time clearly required that he didn't and that is a big difference.

If in particular the "new" English/British don't like our history then perhaps they should find somewhere with a cleaner past to live, but no, we're being brainwashed into being soft and guilt ridden that they'll be allowed to take over, and by they I mean those that don't a depth of Britishness about them.

Sorry, I despair. We are who we are, warts and all. But it seems like cosmetic surgery we want to try and cut out the bits we don't like and in the process we are no longer English. Glad I won't be around long enough to see the end of the Rise and Fall of the British Empire.

By the way, doesn't Nottingham lay claim the the freeing of the first African slave who went on to be come a successful businessman? His grave is marked in St Mary's Churchyard in the Lace Market. And good on him and those around him who must have given him support. Love to hear his views.

[BigFatPie]

Just watched Boris Johnson’s video on the subject. According to him. George Floyd’s death was a ‘spectacle’.

How dare that entitled, privileged f00knugget claim to care about racism when he’s described black people as ‘piccaninnies’ with ‘watermelon smiles’.

How dare that entitled, privileged f00knugget lecture others on social distancing when his top adviser broke every social distancing rule there is, lied about it and still kept his job.

How dare that entitled, privileged f00knugget lecture others on ‘thuggery’ when he’s conspired on tape to have a journalist beaten up.

We are led by donkeys.

[crazyfists]

Sorry Old Pie but I don't believe taking down a statue of a man who made alot of money trading slaves (branded them on the chest with the companies initials, nice) which black people have to walk past every day whilst contributing to the economy makes us or myself less British. They tried putting up an additional plaque explaining about his slave trading but couldn't find the words obviously to justify the plaque and the statue so just left it, it should have come down years ago.

Infact I think as a Briton then we have a duty to be fair and inclusive, yes we have a history and we can acknowledge that whilst at the same time also admitting that in the modern world, some things are in poor taste now. Yes back then it was OK but now its not and people need to take that on board. It's not eroding people's britishness and to say if 'new british' don't like looking at things like statues of slave traders they should bugger off is more a reflection of your archiac views. It's like you can't fly a union jack or St Georges flag apparently when you really can, there are 3 on my street. You're not losing any britishness by holding your hands up and saying yes this shouldn't be here, for me that's adding to your britishness. The world is changing, you can still be British and proud whilst moving into the modern world.

All protests get brought over to criminality by anti government groups so I'm not sure why people are so surprised now and again it's kicking off. It's hard for myself to know exactly how black people feel in today's society, I've got friends but we have never discussed it if I'm honest. I do understand how white people can feel sometimes as I'm not racist, use all communities, have Muslim and black friends etc and am probably still the enemy to some people but we don't know what it's like to be black in this society so I won't judge them.

I am proud to be British, the past is the past, you don't have to scrub it out, just acknowledge that yes we did bad things as well as everyone else, we can't take them back but we can make sure that we don't make people feel unwelcome or that they're not equals anymore, it's not right.

[Old_pie]

Sorry Old Pie but I don't believe taking down a statue of a man who made alot of money trading slaves (branded them on the chest with the companies initials, nice) which black people have to walk past every day whilst contributing to the economy makes us or myself less British. They tried putting up an additional plaque explaining about his slave trading but couldn't find the words obviously to justify the plaque and the statue so just left it, it should have come down years ago.

Infact I think as a Briton then we have a duty to be fair and inclusive, yes we have a history and we can acknowledge that whilst at the same time also admitting that in the modern world, some things are in poor taste now. Yes back then it was OK but now its not and people need to take that on board. It's not eroding people's britishness and to say if 'new british' don't like looking at things like statues of slave traders they should bugger off is more a reflection of your archiac views. It's like you can't fly a union jack or St Georges flag apparently when you really can, there are 3 on my street. You're not losing any britishness by holding your hands up and saying yes this shouldn't be here, for me that's adding to your britishness. The world is changing, you can still be British and proud whilst moving into the modern world.

All protests get brought over to criminality by anti government groups so I'm not sure why people are so surprised now and again it's kicking off. It's hard for myself to know exactly how black people feel in today's society, I've got friends but we have never discussed it if I'm honest. I do understand how white people can feel sometimes as I'm not racist, use all communities, have Muslim and black friends etc and am probably still the enemy to some people but we don't know what it's like to be black in this society so I won't judge them.

I am proud to be British, the past is the past, you don't have to scrub it out, just acknowledge that yes we did bad things as well as everyone else, we can't take them back but we can make sure that we don't make people feel unwelcome or that they're not equals anymore, it's not right.

And I ask where is the line to be drawn and who decides that?

[BigFatPie]

And I ask where is the line to be drawn and who decides that?

We can’t draw the line by agreeing to not keep up statues of actual slavers?

[Elite_Pie]

Infact I think as a Briton then we have a duty to be fair and inclusive, yes we have a history and we can acknowledge that whilst at the same time also admitting that in the modern world, some things are in poor taste now. Yes back then it was OK but now its not and people need to take that on board. It's not eroding people's britishness and to say if 'new british' don't like looking at things like statues of slave traders they should bugger off is more a reflection of your archiac views. It's like you can't fly a union jack or St Georges flag apparently when you really can, there are 3 on my street. You're not losing any britishness by holding your hands up and saying yes this shouldn't be here, for me that's adding to your britishness. The world is changing, you can still be British and proud whilst moving into the modern world.

Exactly right, the world is changing but it's a slow process. Just over a century ago the Suffragettes were regarded as terrorists of their time because they demanded the vote for women. That seems ludicrous now (well, maybe not to one or two on here!), and I think in a couple of centuries racism will be seen the same way. As more and more people realise that skin colour isn't important, there will be more mixed relationships leading to all sorts of skin colours.

Racism is definitely doomed, but it will take a long time. That will just leave religious extremists to sort!