EU and Brexit

[The Bedlington Terrier]

All well and good Mon Ami.

But Europeans have been leaving the UK in large numbers recently.

This is bad news for our NHS, which has around 100,000 unfilled posts, and 112.000 vacancies in social care, a large proportion of who are on zero hour contracts.

Other sectors have been affected as well.

No excuse for unemployment then 59er?

[The Bedlington Terrier]

I am not sure that jobs having Zero hours contracts is good news. One of my grandchildren was unfortunate to get a job at McDonalds the way they treated their staff was appalling. Scheduling an 8 hour shift with a 04:30 start where there is no public transport meaning the only way to get to work was a taxi, which incurred extra fare because of the time. Then told to go home at 07:30 as there was not enough work for them, hardly earned enough to pay the taxi fare incurred earlier.

Different question is that though V_C. That is exactly the reason why we need more Trade Union involvement to stop these shoddy employer practices.

[oldcolner]

Different question is that though V_C. That is exactly the reason why we need more Trade Union involvement to stop these shoddy employer practices.

I accept some companies like that MacDonalds franchise seems to be are unfair and or unreasonable but used properly they can benefit workers too BT

Flexibility
Zero hours contracts can be particularly appealing to people who need the flexibility of being able to turn down work, or not having a particular schedule. Students in particular find these kinds of contracts a great way to work as you can turn down hours during busier study times.

Opportunity
Taking on a job with a zero hours contract can be a great way to get your foot in the door of a company you really want to work for if they don’t have a full-time fixed contract available for you. Making yourself known while working on a flexible contract can be a good way to make yourself available for consideration should something more permanent arise. Make the most of the flexibility by showing your availability to work at short notice and at unusual times if possible.

It can also be good for those that don’t mind working unusual hours outside the standard 9-5 that many jobs offer. You can also, in theory, take holiday whenever you want without having to get it cleared from your boss first.

Extra Income
As there are no set hours, one of the upsides of zero hours contracts is the ability to pack in extra hours as they become available, so if you need extra money one month, you might be able to work twice the hours you worked the previous month and earn extra money.

Similarly, as you’re not tied into any particular hours with one company, you should be able to work for more than one company at a time.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

I accept some companies like that MacDonalds franchise seems to be are unfair and or unreasonable but used properly they can benefit workers too BT

Flexibility
Zero hours contracts can be particularly appealing to people who need the flexibility of being able to turn down work, or not having a particular schedule. Students in particular find these kinds of contracts a great way to work as you can turn down hours during busier study times.

Opportunity
Taking on a job with a zero hours contract can be a great way to get your foot in the door of a company you really want to work for if they don’t have a full-time fixed contract available for you. Making yourself known while working on a flexible contract can be a good way to make yourself available for consideration should something more permanent arise. Make the most of the flexibility by showing your availability to work at short notice and at unusual times if possible.

It can also be good for those that don’t mind working unusual hours outside the standard 9-5 that many jobs offer. You can also, in theory, take holiday whenever you want without having to get it cleared from your boss first.

Extra Income
As there are no set hours, one of the upsides of zero hours contracts is the ability to pack in extra hours as they become available, so if you need extra money one month, you might be able to work twice the hours you worked the previous month and earn extra money.

Similarly, as you’re not tied into any particular hours with one company, you should be able to work for more than one company at a time.

All well and good OC, but like V_C says, McDonalds in particular, treats its employees like sh!t and get away with it because the kids have no protection or worker's rights.

[sinkov]

I am not sure that jobs having Zero hours contracts is good news. One of my grandchildren was unfortunate to get a job at McDonalds the way they treated their staff was appalling. Scheduling an 8 hour shift with a 04:30 start where there is no public transport meaning the only way to get to work was a taxi, which incurred extra fare because of the time. Then told to go home at 07:30 as there was not enough work for them, hardly earned enough to pay the taxi fare incurred earlier.

I would hope that the 100,000 unfilled jobs in the NHS, caused by EU nationals deserting this country in droves according to 59, are not zero hours contracts VC.

[oldcolner]

I would hope that the 100,000 unfilled jobs in the NHS, caused by EU nationals deserting this country in droves according to 59, are not zero hours contracts VC.

All NHS Hospital & Community Health Service (HCHS) staff show numbers growing sinkov.

1,164,729 FTE (full time equivalents) in September 2020. This is 4.5% (50,256) more than in September 2019.
1,313,765 Headcount in September 2020. This is 4.2% (53,012) more than in September 2019.

30,000 NHS workers were Sep 2019 employed on zero hours contracts, new GMB analysis of official figures has revealed.
These will be non professional roles.

[1959_60]

The current number of unfilled jobs in the NHS is 87,237, or 6.9% of the required workforce.

In social care there are 112,000 unfilled vacancies, or 7.3% of the required workforce.
24% of social care workers are on zero hours contracts.

Without doubt, and especially in social care, the impact of Brexit on staffing levels has been considerable, but not the only factor of course.

When my Dad needed care at home we had carers coming in four times a day. Most of them started at 7AM and didn't finish until as late as 11PM.
Bearing in mind the low wages in this job, it is hardly surprising that there is a massive turnover of staff (30% per year).

Until this v1tal job is given more esteem, better pay and decent working hours, our most vulnerable will continue to get a very substandard quality of care.

The vast majority of the carers we had contact with were absolutely committed and cared about their patients.

But they get insufficient training, shocking pay and conditions, and their jobs are simply not recognised as being very important, which is ludicrous.

Definitely time for a reset.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

The current number of unfilled jobs in the NHS is 87,237, or 6.9% of the required workforce.

In social care there are 112,000 unfilled vacancies, or 7.3% of the required workforce.
24% of social care workers are on zero hours contracts.

Without doubt, and especially in social care, the impact of Brexit on staffing levels has been considerable, but not the only factor of course.

When my Dad needed care at home we had carers coming in four times a day. Most of them started at 7AM and didn't finish until as late as 11PM.
Bearing in mind the low wages in this job, it is hardly surprising that there is a massive turnover of staff (30% per year).

Until this v1tal job is given more esteem, better pay and decent working hours, our most vulnerable will continue to get a very substandard quality of care.

The vast majority of the carers we had contact with were absolutely committed and cared about their patients.

But they get insufficient training, shocking pay and conditions, and their jobs are simply not recognised as being very important, which is ludicrous.

Definitely time for a reset.

Not often I can find congruence with you 59er, but you are spot on with the carer situation, it really is ludicrous. UNITE.

[kritichris]

My wife's a carer working through an agency, Consultas. They can't meet demand and so employ loads of South Africans following a recruitment drive there. At one point last year they even chartered their own flight to bring the carers here. They are lowly paid but get their travel costs met and whilst working the clients have to provide for their needs, food and other consumables so that when they return to S.A. they have saved up a considerable sum by their standards. If carers here were paid decent wages this wouldn't be necessary.

[oldcolner]

The current number of unfilled jobs in the NHS is 87,237, or 6.9% of the required workforce.

In social care there are 112,000 unfilled vacancies, or 7.3% of the required workforce.
24% of social care workers are on zero hours contracts.

Without doubt, and especially in social care, the impact of Brexit on staffing levels has been considerable, but not the only factor of course.

When my Dad needed care at home we had carers coming in four times a day. Most of them started at 7AM and didn't finish until as late as 11PM.
Bearing in mind the low wages in this job, it is hardly surprising that there is a massive turnover of staff (30% per year).
.

Where are you getting your stats from 59-60.
NHS vacancy reports go back to June 2020 but are full of warnings as four different ways of estimating them are used. The numbers change daily.

The numbers do not seem high in % terms to me for an organisation that has lots of staff in training many moving round from one hospital to another or out to general practice

These are from 2018 for comparison https://www.ons.gov.uk/economy/gover...tor/2019-08-06
In 2018, the National Health Service (NHS) had the highest vacancy rate (8.5%, which equates to 100,500 vacancies, including for doctors and nurses). Adult social care the workforce, responsible for caring for some of the most vulnerable members of society, had the second-highest vacancy rate (8.0%, equating to 110,000 vacancies). Children’s social care services had a vacancy rate of 4.7%, which was higher than the UK average of “all industries”of 2.8%

If your figures are correct the Vacancy levels seem to have improved in both sectors. I’m sure Brexit had some impact but not sure how much

I found these relating to EU nationals in August 2019.
There were over 1 million people (913,789 full-time equivalents) working in healthcare roles in NHS hospitals in England in March 2019: 6% were EU nationals and 8% non-EU nationals (this excludes NHS infrastructure support staff).
15 Aug 2019

Many of the EU nationals will be senior staff unlikely to move.

I agree with your sentiments about social care staff, just not sure your Brexit argument is at the root of it. Social care funding is local authority driven.