EU and Brexit

[1959_60]

Here you go OC - data up to September 2020 from NHS Digital.

https://digital.nhs.uk/data-and-info...september-2020

[1959_60]

Hi OC.

I think you have to do a compare and contrast between pre Brexit (2016) to see the impact of Europeans going home, or deciding not to come any more.

I'm not suggesting that Brexit is the only, or main, reason for the vacancies by the way, but it is obviously part of it.

[oldcolner]

Hi OC.

I think you have to do a compare and contrast between pre Brexit (2016) to see the impact of Europeans going home, or deciding not to come any more.

I'm not suggesting that Brexit is the only, or main, reason for the vacancies by the way, but it is obviously part of it.

Thanks I can’t open the reports on my iPad and not wanting to get into a stats war. They do advise not to use them for year on year comparisons as Brexit has impacted on data collection. Apologies if I took the Brexit thrust too strongly.

There are issues between the NHS and Social Care provision and funding. Services I set up for support for drug misusers and public health in the NHS were transferred to local authority control in Scotland 5 or more years ago and were seen by local authorities as ways of generating money for them and their funding gap and were shut down fairly quickly.

[oldcolner]

Nothing to do with the thread title
I got involved in social and health integration. One study showed that the majority of NHS costs are spent on a small number of high cost patients. This was deemed too sensitive to publicise at the time.

This seems to say the same thing for England

The mean costs per patient in 2014/15 by cost group are used. The paper finds that the total mean cost per patient in the high-cost, high-need group (£9,789) was 20.1 times higher than the mean cost for all other patients (£487). This large difference between the high-cost, high-need group and all other patients was primarily driven by the difference in mean costs per patient of inpatient care (£6,892 vs £128) and, to a lesser extent, outpatient care (£1,582 vs £142).
For inpatient care, the mean costs per patient for the high-cost, high-need group were 53.9 times higher than for all other patients; for outpatient care, they were 11.2 times higher; for A&E care, they were 12.4 times higher; for primary care, they were 3.8 times higher; and for GP-prescribed drug therapy, they were 6.4 times higher.
I guess there are high cost social care patients too and quite a lot will be in the high cost health group too.
As we keep more people alive longer the high costs groups will grow in number. It’s a big dilemma and no solution has been found here. In the US if you can’t pay you die. Here people who want to die are forced to live.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

Boris will find a solution OC, it's called eugenics. Withhold the vax, problem solved. He will copy the Yanks, mark my words...

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/09/w...ne-supply.html

[1959_60]

Nothing to do with the thread title
I got involved in social and health integration. One study showed that the majority of NHS costs are spent on a small number of high cost patients. This was deemed too sensitive to publicise at the time.

This seems to say the same thing for England

The mean costs per patient in 2014/15 by cost group are used. The paper finds that the total mean cost per patient in the high-cost, high-need group (£9,789) was 20.1 times higher than the mean cost for all other patients (£487). This large difference between the high-cost, high-need group and all other patients was primarily driven by the difference in mean costs per patient of inpatient care (£6,892 vs £128) and, to a lesser extent, outpatient care (£1,582 vs £142).
For inpatient care, the mean costs per patient for the high-cost, high-need group were 53.9 times higher than for all other patients; for outpatient care, they were 11.2 times higher; for A&E care, they were 12.4 times higher; for primary care, they were 3.8 times higher; and for GP-prescribed drug therapy, they were 6.4 times higher.
I guess there are high cost social care patients too and quite a lot will be in the high cost health group too.
As we keep more people alive longer the high costs groups will grow in number. It’s a big dilemma and no solution has been found here. In the US if you can’t pay you die. Here people who want to die are forced to live.

Fascinating OC.

I believe that social Care costs are met much more by the state in Scotland than the UK.

We have just submitted a proposed policy paper to the Lib Dems calling for (I'll not bore you with the figures),
A much more integrated health/care system funded by a new hypothecated (ring-fenced) tax.
A massive increase in the social care budget to bring service levels back to 2010 levels, and to increase the wages of the staff.
Even more money to implement a Dilnot Report style service that will give people free care at the point of need.
Changes in how the services interface and the establishment of a professional body for care workers comparable to the Royal College of Nursing to raise the status of the profession and provide oversight of professional standards and a training framework for initial and continuing professional development that provides clear career progression pathways.
Other stuff.

I believe that, if Beveridge was around today and looking at improving the services, then he would include Social care, free at the point of need, as part of the mix.

I'm sure that when he proposed the NHS, people were telling him, "We can't possible offer free medical treatment to everyone"

It just takes political will to do the right thing.

[The Bedlington Terrier]

Only the Lib Dems could come up with such precocious nonsense, "hypothecated"...

[1959_60]

Only the Lib Dems could come up with such precocious nonsense, "hypothecated"...

Well, Corbyn's lot were proposing hypothecated taxes in the run up to the 2019 election...?

https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/upl...eal-Change.pdf

[The Bedlington Terrier]

Well, Corbyn's lot were proposing hypothecated taxes in the run up to the 2019 election...?

https://labour.org.uk/wp-content/upl...eal-Change.pdf

Aye and look what happened to them?

Your lot never learn 59er.

[1959_60]

Aye and look what happened to them?

Your lot never learn 59er.

True BT...he should have used "ring-fenced", and so should I