O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[Andy_Faber]

I have a good friend, in his late 70s, lives in Germany. Not yet contacted for a jab. Has made an appointment for a test so he can visit his son, daughter in law and grandkids for the first time in almost a year.

What’s the latest in Netherlands? Always interesting to get a residents perspective of somewhere else

[MadAmster]

Apart from curfew now starting at 22:00 instead of 21:00, no change in measures.

New cases on the up.
Hospitalisations on the up.
ICU usage up.

Not really surprising when you consider we let kindergartens and junior schools back and cases in the 5 to 12 years ols bracket went up. Now secondary schools are back. Cases 12 - 18 are on the up. For no obvious reason, cases among 18 to 24 year olds is also up. After the current "break" all further education places will start to provide "proper" classes/lectures" one day a week. We can expect 18 - 24 rates to increase.

The test events we have had (conference, theatre, concerts, dance events, football etc) have not yielded new cases up and the plans for those are now being tweaked for follow up trial events with even more people there. Last Saturday's Netherlands v Latvia game had 5000 fans at the game (capacity >50K). They were all sat where they'd been told to sit. Various groups around the stadium. All tested beforehand, some areas masked others not, some distanced, others not. Beer and other refreshments available before, after and during the game. All had a sensor which mapped all movement, the number of contacts, how close those contacts were etc etc. This week they will all be tested again, the reults analysed and plans made to up the % of fans at the next trial.

In all honesty, I'm not expecting any easing of measures until June/July.

On the vaccination front, we're up to 2.5M first doses, that's 14% of the population so far. Supply is still the problem. We do have a "stockpile" of some 600K but they are earmarked, at the moment, for the 2nd doses in order to make sure people get the 2nd within the time frame we currently use which is, I think, 6 weeks.

The delivery of the doses we have is efficient. We just don't have enough of them.

The general consensus is that 5h1t happens and we'll wait our turn. A very unDutch train of thought.

[ramAnag]

Apart from curfew now starting at 22:00 instead of 21:00, no change in measures.

New cases on the up.
Hospitalisations on the up.
ICU usage up.

Not really surprising when you consider we let kindergartens and junior schools back and cases in the 5 to 12 years ols bracket went up. Now secondary schools are back. Cases 12 - 18 are on the up. For no obvious reason, cases among 18 to 24 year olds is also up. After the current "break" all further education places will start to provide "proper" classes/lectures" one day a week. We can expect 18 - 24 rates to increase.

The test events we have had (conference, theatre, concerts, dance events, football etc) have not yielded new cases up and the plans for those are now being tweaked for follow up trial events with even more people there. Last Saturday's Netherlands v Latvia game had 5000 fans at the game (capacity >50K). They were all sat where they'd been told to sit. Various groups around the stadium. All tested beforehand, some areas masked others not, some distanced, others not. Beer and other refreshments available before, after and during the game. All had a sensor which mapped all movement, the number of contacts, how close those contacts were etc etc. This week they will all be tested again, the reults analysed and plans made to up the % of fans at the next trial.

In all honesty, I'm not expecting any easing of measures until June/July.

On the vaccination front, we're up to 2.5M first doses, that's 14% of the population so far. Supply is still the problem. We do have a "stockpile" of some 600K but they are earmarked, at the moment, for the 2nd doses in order to make sure people get the 2nd within the time frame we currently use which is, I think, 6 weeks.

The delivery of the doses we have is efficient. We just don't have enough of them.

The general consensus is that 5h1t happens and we'll wait our turn. A very unDutch train of thought.

What about the Dutch attitude to the UK, MA?
Do they feel we’ve handled things better than the NL/EU or that we’ve acted selfishly? Is it one of admiration, condemnation or do they think that we too will be in line for a further ‘wave’, just a little later than the rest of Europe as it was a year ago?

[MadAmster]

More like jealousy that the UK, on vaccinations, seems to have all their ducks in a row whilst we are still short on vaccines. Now the Janssen vaccine, made in Leiden, about 15 miles from me, has been certified by the EMA, you could be excused for thinking we'd start getting more doses than you shake a syringe at. You would, owever, be wrong. The vaccine is made here............ then it goes to the USA to be bottled and then it comes back here..... in theory. Not much getting back at the moment, though.

[Geoff Parkstone]

What about the Dutch attitude to the UK, MA?
Do they feel we've handled things better than the NL/EU or that we've acted selfishly?

Now there's a loaded question. Or is it a Leiden one?

[Andy_Faber]

Do they feel we’ve handled things better than the NL/EU or that we’ve acted selfishly?

One thing that cuts right across any vaccine nationalism here (and I would back the EU if the positions were reversed) is that the allocation of vaccines is an issue of contract law. U.K. and EU are equally ‘entitled/affluent’ as one another so there is no humanitarian aspect to consider, so it all comes down to who, legally, does each (next) vial of vaccine belong to. If, as it seems, the U.K. contracts state absolutes/first dibs and the EU contracts state ‘do your best/we’ll join the queue’ then there is no U.K. selfishness about it, and the EU mantra of ‘fairness’ is a smokescreen for their deal doing deficiencies, and selfishness in itself. I repeat I’d have the same view if positions were reversed

[MadAmster]

Now there's a loaded question. Or is it a Leiden one?

More like the blind Leiden the blind GP.

[ramAnag]

Now there's a loaded question.

It absolutely wasn’t a ‘loaded question’. It was a completely open question and I was genuinely interested in the response.

Clearly you’ve misunderstood what a loaded question is so here’s an example...GP, are you ever going stop your wannabe controversial point scoring nonsense and return to being the valued poster you once were?

Andy...I didn’t infer that there was any UK selfishness...I was simply asking our NL correspondent what the Dutch attitude to the UK’s handling of the vaccine roll out was.

[Andy_Faber]

Andy...I didn’t infer that there was any UK selfishness...I was simply asking our NL correspondent what the Dutch attitude to the UK’s handling of the vaccine roll out was.

I wasn’t inferring that you were inferring. Just putting a purely commercial as opposed to political spin on it

[Trickytreesreds]

The EU just doesn't do itself any favours does it?

Already with backs against the wall, VDL now snubs the global pandemic response call.
Maybe nationalism is winning the federalism war, through an inept commission of calamity.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world...se/ar-BB1f7isn