Yorkshire CCC Racist Row

[Leicesterbaggie]

If we are being completely honest, one of the worst types of intolerance comes from the Indian community with its caste system.

[baggieal]

BS.......some of the worst racism I’ve ever encountered was during my time as a rep for a frozen food company in the West Mids.

Regardless of you making light about Indians not being offended by mistaken for Pakistani’s that is not my experience.

They absolutely loathed each other!

The Indians routinely referred to their near neighbours as “dirty P*****”.......I can only comment on what I regularly heard.

When I moved into the sport’s trade I dealt with a well known Indian family who owned a sports wholesale business on Tame Rd in Witton, the Nathwani family.....lovely people.

They gave me a lot of help when I first set up my own business and even let me use their warehouse, I generally found the Indian people much nicer and easier to deal with but they never hid their contempt for Pakistani’s.

The worst racism I have ever personally had to deal with was at a six a side tournament on our own Hawthorns pitch about 10 years ago.

An all Pakistani heritage side from Pleck constantly abused my lads from minute one in the game even though we had an Indian lad playing for my side.

I complained to the black referee about it and he dismissively waved me away, I complained to the organisers from the club on the day and got fobbed off.

Our Indian lad was the son of a former poster on her, a guy called HS Baggie, his name was Harry Singh, a very successful businessman who lived next door to Marc Antoine Fortune by pure coincidence.

Harry came up to me after the game and put his arm around me and apologised profusely on behalf of all Asians, he was disgusted at how my lads and his own son had been treated.

He finished off by saying.....”but that’s what I expect from THAT lot”.

I accept your premise that the “P” word is used negatively though, I was really trying to establish the fact that most other nations are not a bit bothered by being abbreviated.

My own view on the whole situation is that a line needs drawing in the sand that everyone is aware of and from that point forward everyone knows that use of these terms is going to have serious repercussions.....going back 10 to 15 years is just digging for the sake of it.

Let me lighten the mood by highlighting a faux pas of my own yesterday.

I was in a business meeting with my team of solicitors and a very attractive trainee lady was taking the notes.

In the course of the conversation I used the phrase “tits up” before the light bulb went on in my head!😩😳

I immediately apologised and she laughed it off, I hope that she didn’t just laugh because she felt she had to though.

Retraining the brain isn’t easy at my time of life and for much older people but it clearly shows how easy it is to put your foot in it these days.

I bet when you said tits up your eyes were fully on her tits😆. I am far more professional and wear dark shades 😎

[boingy]

Lots of totally reasonable comments on this thread. None of us like to see people being treated badly whether it’s physically or verbally.

[baggieal]

Lots of totally reasonable comments on this thread. None of us like to see people being treated badly whether it’s physically or verbally.

My kids were and are brought up to be kind to everyone and have respect for everything and everyone. There are scumbags in every race and colour likewise there’s some kind and fantastic people in every race and colour. Look beyond someone’s colour or even a white guy who may have tattoos all over his face.

In fact from experience the nicest and kindest people are those who have very little and the ones with money can be complete W ankers and up their own backsides.

[Omegstrat6]

My kids were and are brought up to be kind to everyone and have respect for everything and everyone. There are scumbags in every race and colour likewise there’s some kind and fantastic people in every race and colour. Look beyond someone’s colour or even a white guy who may have tattoos all over his face.

In fact from experience the nicest and kindest people are those who have very little and the ones with money can be complete W ankers and up their own backsides.

Very true. I once got to know "King fu" Barry Theobald by which time he sported several facial tatoos that tended to put a lot of people off. Now here was some one you didn't want to mess with but he was also one of the nicest people you could meet.

[westcountryvillain]

Pakistani's and Indians have always hated each other by and large, it's obviously gone down through generations in the same way other tribal divisions do.

I agree on drawing a line in the sand but that just won't happen, there's always some w@nker with an agenda looking to stir things up as has been the case with recently with slavery.

[BaggieSingh]

I think we are in agreement most people are likeminded with the same needs and wants
A bit of empathy goes a long way

I also agree things shouldn’t be dragged up for years and years

Also Mick, I think you misunderstood me I’m not saying Indians and Pakistanis don’t get on, but it’s not being mistaken for the other that is the offensive part

Also some of the reasons for the divide may be due to the haphazard way the British dealt with the 1947 division of India and the hundreds of thousands of lives lost after
India used to be quite secular before that for quite a while, but as I’ve always said humans can always divide each other and find differences and people will always exploit this and also exploit the people trying to help

[mickd1961]

In regards to the Michael Vaughan situation.

How frightening it is now to be a white person in this type of situation.

Rafiq makes an allegation a decade down the line and the club handle it badly.

A couple of years later Vaughan’s name crops up and a little known Asian player of that generation says he heard what Vaughan supposedly said......where’s he been hiding for the last 12 years!?

Vaughan is in danger of being binned off by all of his employers without a shred of hard evidence.

What’s happened to the presumption of innocence in this country?

It really is alarming that as soon as a black person makes an allegation against a white person nowadays that the white guy is presumed guilty.

I have no idea if Vaughan is guilty or not but without a sound recording of the incident it’s impossible to know, it’s hearsay.

It would be interesting to read any text messages between Rafiq and this other ex player to see if there’s an agenda whereby they’re using this to settle old scores with Vaughan.

Vaughan is a c o c k y b a s t a r d at the best of times, a bit of a smart a r s e in my opinion but without absolute proof then he doesn’t deserve to be sacked from media jobs.

Yorkshire have handled this badly but the way a guy like Vaughan can by thrown under the bus and prescribed as guilty is a disgrace.

[BaggieSingh]

Wasn’t just Yorkshire who dealt with this poorly was the sponsors
Let’s face it it’s not the only time this has happened
Sponsors always get nervous when there is potential for scandal which their brand could be associated with

Also there could be lots more behind the scenes that we are not privileged to

I’m kinda torn, I agree that it’s harsh, but I also think the way that non white people have been dealt with is too, there was quite a good series of documentaries that sky did on this in cricket earlier in the year should be available on catchup

[Leicesterbaggie]

You are so correct mick. What evidence is there for or against the allegations against Michael Vaughan? I'm not saying that he is innocent but on the other hand I'm not saying that he is guilty. The two things that concern me most are, firstly, why are these allegations surfacing now after so many years and secondly, as you say, if allegations are made against a white person, they are usually believed.

Personally, I do think that Yorkshire C. C. have a lot of questions to answer but I just hope that Vaughan is not fed to the wolves without hard evidence.