Admin appeals 12 point deduction

[Trickytreesreds]

The appeal seems to have been put on hold...... https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59215252

Might it be that the reported deal of 3 points for FFP breaches is in return for dropping our appeal?

If accepting the 12 in return for "only an extra 3" means getting a sale completed, to someone who is in it for the right reasons (and maybe a selfish one or two as well), before the January transfer window opens then I am all for it. Especially considering my view that the appeal is a non-starter as Mel had overspent by about £220M over 6 years prior to Covid. Covid was no ore than the last straw IMO.

Might it just be that this was the outcome the Admins were angling after when they launched the appeal? If so, great move lads.

If it was, then I think Reading would have something to say about that.
12 points foradmin was a given for anyone.

To wangle 9 +3 down to 3, when Reading got 9, opens a can of worms. I can't see it.

[MadAmster]

If it was, then I think Reading would have something to say about that.
12 points foradmin was a given for anyone.

To wangle 9 +3 down to 3, when Reading got 9, opens a can of worms. I can't see it.

Who mentioned 9 + 3 apart from you TTR? My post, which you quoted and answered, states QUOTE If accepting the 12 in return for "only an extra 3" means getting a sale completed UNQUOTE. When I went to school 12 + 3 was 15.

The 12 being for Administration and 3 for FFP.

[Trickytreesreds]

Who mentioned 9 + 3 apart from you TTR? My post, which you quoted and answered, states QUOTE If accepting the 12 in return for "only an extra 3" means getting a sale completed UNQUOTE. When I went to school 12 + 3 was 15.

The 12 being for Administration and 3 for FFP.

OK lets start again.
12 is for going into admin. That's the rule not really an argument.

Breaking FFP. The league said DCFC was under a 9point deduction for punishment, + 3 more if wages are not paid.

Now you are saying the punishment is 3?
Reading have been told to expect a 9 point hit for breaking FFP. Do you see the logic here?
would you take that lying down as a Reading owner, never mind the likes of Wycombe?

[MadAmster]

OK lets start again.
12 is for going into admin. That's the rule not really an argument.

Breaking FFP. The league said DCFC was under a 9point deduction for punishment, + 3 more if wages are not paid.

Now you are saying the punishment is 3?
Reading have been told to expect a 9 point hit for breaking FFP. Do you see the logic here?
would you take that lying down as a Reading owner, never mind the likes of Wycombe?

Yeah, let's start again.

We currently have a 12 point penalty for going into Admin. That is TWELVE. The appeal has been adjourned so we still have that TWELVE point deduction in place for going into Admin. TWELVE POINTS!!

There have been various number thrown around from various places about how many points deduction there might be for any FFP infringements. None of those reports have been OFFICIAL reports from either the EFL or DCFC. THESE WILL BE OVER AND ABOVE the 12 points deducted for entering Administration. 9 points has been bandied about in the press which would make it 21 in total. Mel, in his infamous Radio Derby interview said 4 points which make 16 in total. Today the appeal has been adjourned according to news sources and those same sources have mentioned a 3 point deduction for FFP infringements making 15 in total. I hope that makes it all clear to you as you seem to be under the misaprehension that I have said we'll end up with less than 12 in total. I HAVEN"T.

Which part of QUOTE If accepting the 12 in return for "only an extra 3" means getting a sale completed UNQUOTE. When I went to school 12 + 3 was 15. leads you to believe I was claiming we'd end up with a total 3 point penalty when it should be quite clear from what I wrote (the word EXTRA being a huge clue) that I was saying 12 + 3?

I even wrote in the bit you quoted that QUOTE When I went to school 12 + 3 was 15. The 12 being for Administration and 3 for FFP. UNQUOTE

BTW - I wasn't saying anything, merely reporting what was in the press and saying that IF there has been a compromise and we get the full 12 for Admin plus only an extra 3 FFP for not going further with our appeal then that would be good.

Reading? At the moment they have had ZERO points deducted............... How much did they exceed FFP by? I don't know. Do you? How much has DCFC exceeded FFP by? I don't know. Do you?

[Trickytreesreds]

Yeah, let's start again.

We currently have a 12 point penalty for going into Admin. That is TWELVE. The appeal has been adjourned so we still have that TWELVE point deduction in place for going into Admin. TWELVE POINTS!!

There have been various number thrown around from various places about how many points deduction there might be for any FFP infringements. None of those reports have been OFFICIAL reports from either the EFL or DCFC. THESE WILL BE OVER AND ABOVE the 12 points deducted for entering Administration. 9 points has been bandied about in the press which would make it 21 in total. Mel, in his infamous Radio Derby interview said 4 points which make 16 in total. Today the appeal has been adjourned according to news sources and those same sources have mentioned a 3 point deduction for FFP infringements making 15 in total. I hope that makes it all clear to you as you seem to be under the misaprehension that I have said we'll end up with less than 12 in total. I HAVEN"T.

Which part of QUOTE If accepting the 12 in return for "only an extra 3" means getting a sale completed UNQUOTE. When I went to school 12 + 3 was 15. leads you to believe I was claiming we'd end up with a total 3 point penalty when it should be quite clear from what I wrote (the word EXTRA being a huge clue) that I was saying 12 + 3?

I even wrote in the bit you quoted that QUOTE When I went to school 12 + 3 was 15. The 12 being for Administration and 3 for FFP. UNQUOTE

BTW - I wasn't saying anything, merely reporting what was in the press and saying that IF there has been a compromise and we get the full 12 for Admin plus only an extra 3 FFP for not going further with our appeal then that would be good.

Reading? At the moment they have had ZERO points deducted............... How much did they exceed FFP by? I don't know. Do you? How much has DCFC exceeded FFP by? I don't know. Do you?

But i said that ?

Administration= 12 points. agreed y/n?

FFP, it was said by sky sports in September via EFL, that nine points was the proposed punishment. 3 suspended pending infringements.
Sheff Weds, were going to be given 12 points but this was reduced to 6 by arbitration, but still applied last season. Ultimately it didn't save them,
DCFC escaped that season unpunished, to the disgust of Wycombe.
What i do know about Reading, was that it was a similar situation with a dodgy stadium sale, as they knew they were sailing close to the wind.
Of course they haven't been docked yet But they have been told to expect 9 points, or at very least 6.

My point is all about, breaching FFP and coming up with floating punishments, opens up all cans of worms.
Can you imagine Derb only getting 3 points/ Reading 9/ Sheff Weds 6? Throw Wycombe in that.

I really don't see how they can be lenient, when this has dragged on like this.
It's like going to court and pleading not guilty. Expect more time on the sentence.

[MadAmster]

But i said that ?

1. Administration= 12 points. agreed y/n?

2. FFP, it was said by sky sports in September via EFL, that nine points was the proposed punishment.

3. 3 suspended pending infringements.

4. Sheff Weds, were going to be given 12 points but this was reduced to 6 by arbitration, but still applied last season. Ultimately it didn't save them,

5. What i do know about Reading, was that it was a similar situation with a dodgy stadium sale, as they knew they were sailing close to the wind.
Of course they haven't been docked yet But they have been told to expect 9 points, or at very least 6.

6. My point is all about, breaching FFP and coming up with floating punishments, opens up all cans of worms.
Can you imagine Derb only getting 3 points/ Reading 9/ Sheff Weds 6? Throw Wycombe in that.

7. I really don't see how they can be lenient, when this has dragged on like this.
It's like going to court and pleading not guilty. Expect more time on the sentence.

1. Yes. Look back and I put it in BOLD type. I have also posted on here that I saw NO reason for us to appeal. However, using the appeal as a possible bargaining chip does look like it might have been a good move.

2. Sky Sports and other outlets said 9. The EFL and DCFC have said absolutely NOTHING on it. In fact, at the time Sky reported 9 points the EFL response was that the discussions were ONGOING.

3. The 3 suspended had nothing to do with FFP. They were put there "just in case" we were late with the wages again.

4. Wednesday's 12 points (reduced to 6 on appeal) were for putting the proceeds of the ground sale into a previous year's accounts to avoid exceeding FFP. The EFL found that Derby's ground sale was above board. I'm not sure why you even mentioned the Wendy deduction as it is not relevant to any punishment Derby have had or might get at this time.

5. Reading. Dodgy stadium sale you say. If you're right then it has no relevance to any FFP measures taken against Derby.

6. As already stated in 4 and 5 above, the transgressions of Wednesday and Reading are not the transgression of which Derby have yet to be charged. I have yet to see an EFL statement saying Derby has been charge with exceeding FFP. Basically, you're trying to correlate the measures taken by SWFR and RFC on the ground sales with FFP measures Derby might get hit with if ever charged on the matter (semantics I know as we will get charged and punished, 99.9999999% certainty)

7. Dragging on. Hardly Derby's fault it's take so long. Covid hasn't helped the situation making it difficult to get people together for hearings and appeals which stretched proceedings. Decisions took forever to come, hardly Derby's fault. The EFL appealed the original not guilty verdicts. Also not Derby's fault.



You still haven't explained how you understood from my previous comments in this thread that we might only get 3 points total. I mentioned the 12 we already have. I said PLUS 3 making 15. As I have already explained, that 3 points was a press report, not my thoughts. I merely said that, if true, it would be great. You then go off on one using comparisons that are as leaky as a colander.

[Trickytreesreds]

1. Yes. Look back and I put it in BOLD type. I have also posted on here that I saw NO reason for us to appeal. However, using the appeal as a possible bargaining chip does look like it might have been a good move.

2. Sky Sports and other outlets said 9. The EFL and DCFC have said absolutely NOTHING on it. In fact, at the time Sky reported 9 points the EFL response was that the discussions were ONGOING.

3. The 3 suspended had nothing to do with FFP. They were put there "just in case" we were late with the wages again.

4. Wednesday's 12 points (reduced to 6 on appeal) were for putting the proceeds of the ground sale into a previous year's accounts to avoid exceeding FFP. The EFL found that Derby's ground sale was above board. I'm not sure why you even mentioned the Wendy deduction as it is not relevant to any punishment Derby have had or might get at this time.

5. Reading. Dodgy stadium sale you say. If you're right then it has no relevance to any FFP measures taken against Derby.

6. As already stated in 4 and 5 above, the transgressions of Wednesday and Reading are not the transgression of which Derby have yet to be charged. I have yet to see an EFL statement saying Derby has been charge with exceeding FFP. Basically, you're trying to correlate the measures taken by SWFR and RFC on the ground sales with FFP measures Derby might get hit with if ever charged on the matter (semantics I know as we will get charged and punished, 99.9999999% certainty)

7. Dragging on. Hardly Derby's fault it's take so long. Covid hasn't helped the situation making it difficult to get people together for hearings and appeals which stretched proceedings. Decisions took forever to come, hardly Derby's fault. The EFL appealed the original not guilty verdicts. Also not Derby's fault.



You still haven't explained how you understood from my previous comments in this thread that we might only get 3 points total. I mentioned the 12 we already have. I said PLUS 3 making 15. As I have already explained, that 3 points was a press report, not my thoughts. I merely said that, if true, it would be great. You then go off on one using comparisons that are as leaky as a colander.

Nixon saying on twitter, it is 12 + 9 for FFP,
Then you can sell.

[swaledale]

1. Yes. Look back and I put it in BOLD type. I have also posted on here that I saw NO reason for us to appeal. However, using the appeal as a possible bargaining chip does look like it might have been a good move.

2. Sky Sports and other outlets said 9. The EFL and DCFC have said absolutely NOTHING on it. In fact, at the time Sky reported 9 points the EFL response was that the discussions were ONGOING.

3. The 3 suspended had nothing to do with FFP. They were put there "just in case" we were late with the wages again.

4. Wednesday's 12 points (reduced to 6 on appeal) were for putting the proceeds of the ground sale into a previous year's accounts to avoid exceeding FFP. The EFL found that Derby's ground sale was above board. I'm not sure why you even mentioned the Wendy deduction as it is not relevant to any punishment Derby have had or might get at this time.

5. Reading. Dodgy stadium sale you say. If you're right then it has no relevance to any FFP measures taken against Derby.

6. As already stated in 4 and 5 above, the transgressions of Wednesday and Reading are not the transgression of which Derby have yet to be charged. I have yet to see an EFL statement saying Derby has been charge with exceeding FFP. Basically, you're trying to correlate the measures taken by SWFR and RFC on the ground sales with FFP measures Derby might get hit with if ever charged on the matter (semantics I know as we will get charged and punished, 99.9999999% certainty)

7. Dragging on. Hardly Derby's fault it's take so long. Covid hasn't helped the situation making it difficult to get people together for hearings and appeals which stretched proceedings. Decisions took forever to come, hardly Derby's fault. The EFL appealed the original not guilty verdicts. Also not Derby's fault.



You still haven't explained how you understood from my previous comments in this thread that we might only get 3 points total. I mentioned the 12 we already have. I said PLUS 3 making 15. As I have already explained, that 3 points was a press report, not my thoughts. I merely said that, if true, it would be great. You then go off on one using comparisons that are as leaky as a colander.

You may as well argue with a brick wall, neither facts nor figures are understood by this buffoon!