Dear Mark and Tony, time to ramp it up

[Arabdownsouth]

I'll take qualifying for Europe (almost) over getting beat off Alloa every day of the week. Credit where its due in my eyes.

[shedka]

"amazing"? I'm all for giving Ogren and his crew the benefit of the doubt but to call what they have done so far as amazing causes me to worry about your sanity. We are pretty much abysmal to watch - we are no different to most of the teams in an absolutely sh1te league. Our crowds have dropped because of the utter lack of entertainment. In your mind this may not be important but the majority of fans want to see their team playing good football and earning the respect of the opposition. As things are fans are losing their passion for the game because they are stumping up hard earned money for an inferior product. If the way United play at the moment is the future of the game (and most Scottish Premiership teams) the game will be brought to it's knees.

"amazing"? I'm all for giving Ogren and his crew the benefit of the doubt but to call what they have done so far as amazing causes me to worry about your sanity. We are pretty much abysmal to watch - we are no different to most of the teams in an absolutely sh1te league. Our crowds have dropped because of the utter lack of entertainment. In your mind this may not be important but the majority of fans want to see their team playing good football and earning the respect of the opposition. As things are fans are losing their passion for the game because they are stumping up hard earned money for an inferior product. If the way United play at the moment is the future of the game (and most Scottish Premiership teams) the game will be brought to it's knees.

Then I counter that with worrying for your sanity or lack of perspective of you think he hasn't been

Fans will just need to wait to see a winning team that comes with entertaining football as that is not a very common theme for United or Scottish teams in general to be quite frank, not sure what era you free up on but unless you witnessed the eighties (when money wasn't as much a factor) then you can count on one hand how many entertaining sides we have had

Ogren HAS been amazing for us, don't even think that can be questioned, pretty much every aspect of the club is improved from the shambles it was when they came in, 2018 we were in a proper bad way, not only on the park but with our future prospects, crowds were the lowest in my lifetime, we were light years from getting back to where we are this season and the fun were looking relatively OK in the top flight with a much better team than us (blew it though)

It's really sad that others don't have the patience to allow us to build to what they want, it's going to take time, we are arguably ahead of schedule potentially getting Europe second year back, we don't have a budget like hearts, nevermind the old firm, we have improved year on year, the fact we have so much complaint about the style of football after the 5/6 years we went through is bizarre imo, we should be embracing being back up and fighting for Europe with an average team ahead of expectations, our ceiling for the next few years is 4th while playing attacking football (hearts will finish in next couple years or so imo), basically where we were pre Feb 2015, so we have some room for improvement still no doubt but right now it's not bad at all

[Arabdownsouth]

Whilst the football hasn't been great the last couple of seasons, we have definitely moved forward as a football club. I think people should maybe remember the years we spent in the championship and going further back, the years before Levein where we were spending every season fighting relegation. Hopefully next season we can get the missing pieces of our jigsaw in place and play with a little more flair at times.

[A. J]

For clarity this thread was about the club's ambitions moving forward.

But to answer a few, yes we are where we are but do we honestly deserve to be in 4th, imo no. We are there not because Ogren has been amazing but because Aberdeen, Hibs and St Johnstone are minging. We are there because more often than not other results have went for us, especially when we have won.

To give credit, Courts has done well given he has impotent forwards, a soft non creative midfield and with an albeit experienced but nevertheless with an OAP in defence.
Alternatively you could say Courts game management has been poor, evidenced by the number of times we have went ahead and not saw it through.
If the club have ambitions then the above needs improvement FACT.
Courts with a year under his belt may look back and learn where he could have been better.

Yes we have moved forward but we will need the backing of Mark and Tony's supposed contacts to get busy and address the squad's weaknesses.

Exciting times ahead imo if they do, but it's an if.

[DUFCstokie]

Then I counter that with worrying for your sanity or lack of perspective of you think he hasn't been

Fans will just need to wait to see a winning team that comes with entertaining football as that is not a very common theme for United or Scottish teams in general to be quite frank, not sure what era you free up on but unless you witnessed the eighties (when money wasn't as much a factor) then you can count on one hand how many entertaining sides we have had

Ogren HAS been amazing for us, don't even think that can be questioned, pretty much every aspect of the club is improved from the shambles it was when they came in, 2018 we were in a proper bad way, not only on the park but with our future prospects, crowds were the lowest in my lifetime, we were light years from getting back to where we are this season and the fun were looking relatively OK in the top flight with a much better team than us (blew it though)

It's really sad that others don't have the patience to allow us to build to what they want, it's going to take time, we are arguably ahead of schedule potentially getting Europe second year back, we don't have a budget like hearts, nevermind the old firm, we have improved year on year, the fact we have so much complaint about the style of football after the 5/6 years we went through is bizarre imo, we should be embracing being back up and fighting for Europe with an average team ahead of expectations, our ceiling for the next few years is 4th while playing attacking football (hearts will finish in next couple years or so imo), basically where we were pre Feb 2015, so we have some room for improvement still no doubt but right now it's not bad at all

My sanity went out the window in the mid sixties when my father started taking me to Tannadice. The family left Dundee in the late sixties but I started attending games the first season of the Scottish Premier leagues (1975) and every game was an away game for me. To the day I die United will be in my blood. I have had the privilege to see United when other teams absolutely envied out set up. That 1975 season, as we all know, United scraped their way out of relegation. But we were still gaining admiration from other teams because of our style of football.
Times have changed and the game is nowhere near it was (money!!!). Perhaps it's an age thing but I don't see why fighting relegation or battling for a European place can't be done whilst playing good football. The way United play at the moment (along with a lot of other teams) isn't going to attract younger fans - the life blood of our future support. I may be dwelling on the past but FFS some of our players seem to struggle with the basics of the game. Maybe I'm dreaming but what I would give to see United playing with passion and flair and putting the fear up other sides. Where would we be without dreams?
Admire your optimism and positivity SHEDKA but what we are watching at the moment is a vastly inferior United compared with the teams of my Shed days.

[Arabdownsouth]

My sanity went out the window in the mid sixties when my father started taking me to Tannadice. The family left Dundee in the late sixties but I started attending games the first season of the Scottish Premier leagues (1975) and every game was an away game for me. To the day I die United will be in my blood. I have had the privilege to see United when other teams absolutely envied out set up. That 1975 season, as we all know, United scraped their way out of relegation. But we were still gaining admiration from other teams because of our style of football.
Times have changed and the game is nowhere near it was (money!!!). Perhaps it's an age thing but I don't see why fighting relegation or battling for a European place can't be done whilst playing good football. The way United play at the moment (along with a lot of other teams) isn't going to attract younger fans - the life blood of our future support. I may be dwelling on the past but FFS some of our players seem to struggle with the basics of the game. Maybe I'm dreaming but what I would give to see United playing with passion and flair and putting the fear up other sides. Where would we be without dreams?
Admire your optimism and positivity SHEDKA but what we are watching at the moment is a vastly inferior United compared with the teams of my Shed days.

The United teams of today and future days will always be vastly inferior to our glorious 70s/80s teams unfortunately

[TerryTheTerror]

The United teams of today and future days will always be vastly inferior to our glorious 70s/80s teams unfortunately

Yes, vastly different times.

[shedka]

Yes and I didn't say you can't go for European football while playing entertaining, but to expect it so soon in the context of where we were as a club and still rebuilding after the 4 years out the top flight from our worst period since pre Jerry Kerrs revolution then I am very very happy with how the last two seasons have gone, nice on the eye or not (we have scored some cracking team goals this season though had to be said), we had consolidated and progressed incrementally

It was takes years to build something good, this was true of Jim McLean days and more recently the Levein/Houston

I'm not being optimistic and positive really, more surprised how quick people's perspective changes and patience runs out, let's keep sight of the bigger picture, we are doing OK but with plenty improvement still needed, don't think that's lost on anyone, myself included, I can be very happy with us being competitive and solid in the top flight again while also recognising we aren't always good on the eye and that we have a good bit to go to get back to being a strong regular top six side

For that you need continuity

I also feel Courts has done well and can get better as he learns more and experiences more, happy with that direction as manager than some tried and tested usual face

[weegiearab]

For clarity this thread was about the club's ambitions moving forward.

But to answer a few, yes we are where we are but do we honestly deserve to be in 4th, imo no. We are there not because Ogren has been amazing but because Aberdeen, Hibs and St Johnstone are minging. We are there because more often than not other results have went for us, especially when we have won.

To give credit, Courts has done well given he has impotent forwards, a soft non creative midfield and with an albeit experienced but nevertheless with an OAP in defence.
Alternatively you could say Courts game management has been poor, evidenced by the number of times we have went ahead and not saw it through.
If the club have ambitions then the above needs improvement FACT.
Courts with a year under his belt may look back and learn where he could have been better.

Yes we have moved forward but we will need the backing of Mark and Tony's supposed contacts to get busy and address the squad's weaknesses.

Exciting times ahead imo if they do, but it's an if.

I agree 100% with this! This transfer window is a biggie! I pray to god we get it right, we are not a million miles away from getting it right and we will hopefully come back wiser for this season. The youths getting a chance and hopefully kicking on would be a great help but we need to address our vulnerabilities. Excited and nervous in equal measures as we haven't been able to fill these voids in the previous transfer windows.

[LSArab]

Massive thanks to the Ogrens

We might still be struggling in the championship if it were not for them - that is the reality

They have turned it around and let’s hope this is only the start

Credit also has to go to recruitment team

They have brought in a number players better than what we had before :

Watt
Fuchs
Levitt
Mulgrew - who some were unsure of when he came in

There’s a great spine of a team there.

Big work to do in the summer but I actually think it’s more high quality players at spine of team - striker, midfielder and defender we need.

Well done to all now let’s kick on and focus on securing 4th

Come on United 🙏🙏🙏