⚽ Match Thread vs. Shrewbury Town FC 01.12.23 [FAC R2]

[SmiffyPie]

All those saying the game wasn't taken seriously have to understand that LW cannot factor in mistakes made by clowns. You could question why LW hasn't got these clowns together and trained the **** out of them until they do what they are required to do. And if, like a poster has suggested, they are afraid to put the ball into row Z because they might get dropped for not following LW's (only) game plan, then LW needs a close look in the mirror.

[countygump]

I genuinely think we should have won that game 2-0, and deserved to based on the overall balance of play. Take out the defensive errors and we were a far better football team than Shrewsbury.

This^^^

I didn't think Shrews were a particularly good team at all, and on another night with no kamikaze defending we would have won comfortably. Bear in mind though that Shrews have an extensive injury list, 11 players it seems.

[durhampie]

All those saying the game wasn't taken seriously have to understand that LW cannot factor in mistakes made by clowns. You could question why LW hasn't got these clowns together and trained the **** out of them until they do what they are required to do. And if, like a poster has suggested, they are afraid to put the ball into row Z because they might get dropped for not following LW's (only) game plan, then LW needs a close look in the mirror.

Just out of curiosity, when do we ever see our so called defenders kick the ball into row Z ??? They would sooner pi** about and give away a goal..

[drillerpie]

Posters that make this point are just stating certain facts, not gaslighting (but it may be gaslighting to say they're gaslighting )

We have only 3 defenders.

They, along with the keeper, are charged with playing the ball out (usually between the 3 of them) and are expected to keep the ball in play as much as possible.

They see more of the ball than any other outfield players.

Ideally we want to 'play through the press' to create overloads further up the pitch.

If we imagine the opposite of all this, a back 4, allowed to play it long, or out of play whenever in doubt, and not the main source of the team's build up....naturally, we'd see far fewer mistakes by defenders. Most of ours seem to be connected to executing those special tasks rather than
traditional defensive actions.

Nobody likes mistakes. Ultimately, careers rise and fall partly on the ability to not make mistakes.

We make a lot of them. In part that's down to the players' characteristics, and partly it's through the way we set up and try to play.

I don't see many facts at all. Most of what you write is your opinion.

We know they are under instructions to bring the ball out when possible - so that is a fact.

But we also know they have licence to go long (goalkeeper too) if needs be - that is another fact.

We know they have licence to take risks - LW has said in the past he won't punish players for trying something that doesn't come off - but we don't know that they are under orders to take risks all the time come what may.

Actually LW prizes control above pretty much all else, so I would be surprised if they were. Therefore, also considering what he said in his interview last night, i think its fair to assume he wants them to use some discretion about when and where to take risks.

Our defenders are ably assisted in playing out by at least one midfielder dropping deep and one wing back, and theybare often not pressed at all or only pressed by one or maybe two players, so it's not just the three of them against the world trying to do an impossible task. Just as they are very rarely left alone to defend the width of the pitch between the three of them, as you have previously said (I have kept an eye out for that happening since you mentioned it a few weeks ago and it has only happened a couple of times in about 10 games)

You wrote that most of our mistakes come from being required to do this special task of playing out, but unless there are stats to back it up that is not a fact either, it's your opinion.

To me it seems we are making continuous mistakes from misunderstandings, overconfidence, laspes in concentration and bad decision making in situations where there isn't even much reward to balance the risk. If we were conceding goals from CBs surging out of defence and beating a couple of men before turning over possession then of course I would agree with you, but that is not what is happening.

I'm not even sure there is any point to this discussion as it feels like we are watching completely different games of football. I basically don't recognise your description of what happens in Notts County matches.

[SmiffyPie]

Just out of curiosity, when do we ever see our so called defenders kick the ball into row Z ??? They would sooner pi** about and give away a goal..

When they piss about they are very good at it! I'm all for playing out when the option is on but when we are under pressure facing our goal (or one of ours has taken a dive under pressure) then LW should be saying "Row Z please". For some reason they don't, why?

This;
"To me it seems we are making continuous mistakes from misunderstandings, overconfidence, laspes in concentration and bad decision making in situations where there isn't even much reward to balance the risk. If we were conceding goals from CBs surging out of defence and beating a couple of men before turning over possession then of course I would agree with you, but that is not what is happening."

[thefulltenyards]

I have watched many a season where our defenders and midfielders regularly found row Z and occasionally the forwards the corner flag.

I can safely say having read the_anticlough's comments and descriptions on matches that I am definitely watching the same games of football.

Most of what is written about games, players and our head coach is of course opinion, some support their views with facts, others seek to shock and be controversial with some interest takes and others state the obvious, as we have seen earlier this afternoon on this thread.

[Elite_Pie]

I would love to know how LW could be accused of not taking the competition seriously.

It's pretty obvious that he doesn't take it seriously with a quick glance at his team selections. In every single cup game we've played under him so far he's played a weakened team. I've understood the reasons until last night, but there I think he got it wrong. I'm sure every team he puts out plays to win, but if that was a league game do you think that we would have started without Cameron, O'Brien, Crowley, Jones and Langstaff?

The plus point is that our weakened team would have beaten their weakened team without the defensive catastrophes. They were poor, but we got what we deserved because you can't gift wrap 3 goals for your opponents.

[durhampie]

I have watched many a season where our defenders and midfielders regularly found row Z and occasionally the forwards the corner flag.

I can safely say having read the_anticlough's comments and descriptions on matches that I am definitely watching the same games of football.

Most of what is written about games, players and our head coach is of course opinion, some support their views with facts, others seek to shock and be controversial with some interest takes and others state the obvious, as we have seen earlier this afternoon on this thread.

You cant comment on what those at the game have witnessed, if you haven't attended yourself. There are too many so called armchair fans giving unfounded comments and criticism....

[thefulltenyards]

I am sorry but that's makes no sense in relation to my post. I have attended hundreds and hundreds of Notts games both home and away and my description above of past Notts is accurate. The ball used to be out of play far more than in the past few years.

In recent times the games I've watched are very similar to the ones the_anticlough describe and I also tend to agree with a lot of his views on tactics, formation and players. Others will disagree, clearly. Plus he never goes out his way to draw at attention to himself by being controversial or holding a grudge against a player. Which is a bonus.

I do however totally agree that if you haven't watched the game live in person on the television or on a live stream then you are on very dodgy ground. Lots of armchair fans at every club, and with freezing temperatures and a cup match who can blame them.

[the_anticlough]

I don't see many facts at all. Most of what you write is your opinion.

Drillerpie back to his disingenuous best...Here are the facts I set out which you want to call opinions

1) We have only 3 defenders.

2) They, along with the keeper, are charged with playing the ball out (usually between the 3 of them) and are expected to keep the ball in play as much as possible.

3)They see more of the ball than any other outfield players.

4) Ideally we want to 'play through the press' to create overloads further up the pitch.

But you just want to win an argument, don't you? As always. Mr. Anally Retentive. OK then, that we play a back 3 is just my opinion. You win.

Actually LW prizes control above pretty much all else, so I would be surprised if they were. Therefore, also considering what he said in his interview last night, i think its fair to assume he wants them to use some discretion about when and where to take risks.

He's also said recently that he has to find that balance between attack and defence so as not to expose the back three. And that sometimes he doesn't. I like the attacking, positive approach. But it acknowledges that he does ask a lot of his defenders.

defenders are ably assisted in playing out by at least one midfielder dropping deep and one wing back, and theybare often not pressed at all or only pressed by one or maybe two players, so it's not just the three of them against the world trying to do an impossible task. Just as they are very rarely left alone to defend the width of the pitch between the three of them, as you have previously said (I have kept an eye out for that happening since you mentioned it a few weeks ago and it has only happened a couple of times in about 10 games)

It happens far more frequently than that.

You wrote that most of our mistakes come from being required to do this special task of playing out, but unless there are stats to back it up that is not a fact either, it's your opinion.

The film's there for all to see.

Take the 3 goals against Shrewsbury. They weren't missed tackles, lost aerial challenges or marking assignments.
No, they were all attempts to play out 1) Baldwin tried to beat his man 2) Randall and Rawlinson were attempting passes. 3) Both Brindley and Baldwin were trying to control the ball in order to use it.
Correct me if my maths is wrong but I make that 3 out of 3
Many other times, it has been the keeper's passes.

Most fans will recognise this. But you want to win, don't you? So scuttle off to your desk or whatever, say "I'll get him this time'' like a latterday Dick Dastardly, and concoct another way to say black is white.

I'm not even sure there is any point to this discussion as it feels like we are watching completely different games of football. I basically don't recognise your description of what happens in Notts County matches.

I'm fine with that. There are many excellent posters here I would look for opinion and analysis before you.
I can't recall you writing a single interesting or insightful thing about the team.