Election Year or Fear!

[ramAnag]

RA, your not making the distinction between those that enable Trump, those who are no fools, and should and do know better, but see him as the path to power despite his undoubted flaws and indeed unscrupulous, criminal behaviour and the average voter who swallows the rhetoric, which appeals to their narrow perspective. AF is actually right in what he says, peoples concerns are very parochial, especially so in the US where millions have little knowledge or awareness of what happens elsewhere in the world or indeed give a toss.

The appeal of the populist is that they offer simple solutions to complex issues, in reality they often offer no solutions just broad unsubstantiated claims, which sound attractive to the majority of what in the US is a very unsophisticated voter base. I mean people who think having 10 days a holiday a year, piss poor wages and very basic health care, whilst an elite enjoy massive salaries and all the perks (of which Trump and his entourage are ironically a part of) and don't think that's odd clearly aren't deep thinkers.

Populists by their nature appear attractive to many because they appeal to be "different", they position themselves as being "one of them" - again Trump with his inherited wealth and lifestyle is about as far from being an ordinary American as one can get, but given the ordinary American doesn't actually think that deeply, they don't care. Somebody different from the rest of the political class is offering them something different, no matter that last time he was in power he didn't actually achieve much that changed things to their extremely simple view of life he might.

Your not wrong to class many of these voters as fools, because that's one of the problems politicians have the world over, the majority of the electorate aren't that bright or actually bothered about thinking deeply about matters, they want a politician that provides the things they value. Lets face it capitalism as it currently operates wouldn't succeed if people actually thought deeply about it, the populists know that if they can keep the majority happy either by lies or bribes, then they can continue to enjoy power and their lifestyles in plain sight.

We really haven't come that far from the peasants being kept in order by a small powerful cabal and indeed that's where Musk and Trump and the others would like to return to. The irony being that Musk and others like him, have openly said that people are too stupid for democracy, they want totalitarian regimes, the benevolent dictator because they know the vast majority of people are either not bothered or too stupid to understand the ramifications.

We overlapped, Swale. Agree with the vast majority of those well made points, not least the dilemma between the theoretical values of democracy v enlightened despotism, but we aren’t there (yet?) and at the moment my brain can only deal with the possibilities and dangers of what is likely to happen across the Atlantic in the next three weeks or so.
As I’ve probably said before…having close family over there, remembering the scenes in Washington when Trump lost and being mindful of some of the ‘threats’ already made my fears are personal as well as political.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Drifting tangentially slightly, who is worse: Trump himself or his typical supporter.? If there wasn't a Trump, would the supporters create a faux Trump to act as spokesman for their beliefs?

[MadAmster]

Does it matter too much who wins next month?

Biden hasn't reversed the tax breaks for the rich brought in by Trump in 2017. Breaks he roundly criticised at the time.

Whoever gets in will do whatever his paymasters want. That's why the likes of Musk et al pour huge amounts of money into campaigns. Simply, to get favourable treatment from the new administration. The bulk of policy is the same or similar with 10 to 15% round the 2 extremes that vary. Two cheeks of the same arse.

[ramAnag]

Does it matter too much who wins next month?

Biden hasn't reversed the tax breaks for the rich brought in by Trump in 2017. Breaks he roundly criticised at the time.

Whoever gets in will do whatever his paymasters want. That's why the likes of Musk et al pour huge amounts of money into campaigns. Simply, to get favourable treatment from the new administration. The bulk of policy is the same or similar with 10 to 15% round the 2 extremes that vary. Two cheeks of the same arse.

I think it matters, MA, that we don’t have a ‘leader of the free world’ who is a convicted criminal with openly misogynistic and racist views.

If an individual holding a relatively ‘junior’ authority figure role - eg GP, bank manager, headteacher, police chief, council leader, football manager - had behaved in the same way as Trump then I think it likely they would have been removed from their position.

I accept your criticism of what amounts to the U.S. ‘establishment’, but would ask…how can it be right for someone to be regarded as fit for holding the office of the most powerful person in the West when their behaviour would prohibit them from running a school or local council?

[swaledale]

Drifting tangentially slightly, who is worse: Trump himself or his typical supporter.? If there wasn't a Trump, would the supporters create a faux Trump to act as spokesman for their beliefs?

An interesting question. I'd say Trump and others like him because they know they are selling snake oil, they know they are telling lies, they know what they are doing is corrupt or criminal but think that laws and such are for the little people.

His supporters, discounting the enablers who are in it for what they can get, are just looking for somebody to provide simple answers that fit in with their views and provide simple answers to matters they don't wish to bother with. So I can't see them having either having the ability or the inclination to create a faux Trump, that would require some deep thinking.

There's a reason fundamental Christianity is big in the US, it provides a comforting answer to those difficult and often unanswerable questions.

[swaledale]

Does it matter too much who wins next month?

Biden hasn't reversed the tax breaks for the rich brought in by Trump in 2017. Breaks he roundly criticised at the time.

Whoever gets in will do whatever his paymasters want. That's why the likes of Musk et al pour huge amounts of money into campaigns. Simply, to get favourable treatment from the new administration. The bulk of policy is the same or similar with 10 to 15% round the 2 extremes that vary. Two cheeks of the same arse.

I think your overlooking the fact that one party at least pays lip service to the rule of law and the principles of democracy which is essential for stability in the world.

[MadAmster]

... and now Musk is giving away $1M, in sort of raffle, every weekend to a Trump voter.

Surely, that must count as bribery and/or unfair influencing of the ballot?

[Andy_Faber]

... and now Musk is giving away $1M, in sort of raffle, every weekend to a Trump voter.

Surely, that must count as bribery and/or unfair influencing of the ballot?

Looking at the wording of the conditions I doubt he’s breaking the law but obviously we here don’t know the whole story or the whole of US state law. The ‘raffle’ is open to all, and there is no link to voting. Not That I can see anyway.

[Andy_Faber]

It appears to be every day by the way

[ramAnag]

... and now Musk is giving away $1M, in sort of raffle, every weekend to a Trump voter.

Surely, that must count as bribery and/or unfair influencing of the ballot?

It’s DAILY, I believe MA…everyday between now and the election, but only open to those, in the ‘swing states’ who sign up to America PAC which is essentially Musk’s political group set up in support of Trump’s election campaign.

Either way it stinks imo. What price democracy? About $1m or £767k per day apparently.