O/T:- Betting odds for US Election [The USA Politics Thread]

[jackal2]

That’s all remarkably well argued but again I don’t know why you quoted my post because it had nothing to do with what I said. You ascribed the values of Martin Luther King to members of the Tory party because they er voted for Kemi Badenoch instead of the non entity that is Robert Jenrick ( a man who lost an election when he was the only candidate). That is imo laughably ridiculous. To make that claim is as idiotic saying ‘I can’t be racist because my best mate is black’.

So let's accept your argument that Conservatives voted for Kemi Badenoch because she was better than a poor opponent in Robert Jenrick. I agree entirely that Robert Jenrick is a non-entity, but therein lies the obvious point. Conservative Party members concluded that Kemi was clearly the best candidate and voted for her on merit. A bunch of racists and white supremacists would surely have concluded that they wouldn't vote for a black candidate under any circumstances, even if it meant electing the crap white guy?

I didn't ascribe the entire value set of Martin Luther King to members of the Conservative Party. What I did do was take MLK's most recognised quote and observe that Conservative Party members did indeed judge Kemi Badenoch "by the content of her character" and not "by the colour of her skin", which was the dream he described: i.e. a situation where people are judged on merit not on ethnicity/skin colour.

You said all this while at the same time speaking up for Donald Trump, a white supremacist who amongst other things recently claimed that Haitian immigrants are eating people’s pets ( a common far right trope). What do you think MLK would have thought of that? Be honest.

Of course I'll be honest. I very much doubt MLK would have liked that comment and I thought it was nonsense too for that matter.

If MLK meant what he said about a world where people are judged on the content of their character (i.e. merit) and not by the colour of their skin, he would also surely be dismayed to see identity politics such as skin colour/ethnicity still being made an issue by any major political parties some 60 years on, when his dream was a world where it simply shouldn't be a factor. If he meant what he said and was not a forerunner of some of the hypocritical progressives these days, then I agree with MLK 100% that discrimination is senseless, be it negative or positive. For example, anybody running a business who appoints an employee based on 'identity' rather than ability and merit is an idiot, and will probably lose money and fail.

Similar to Slack Pie, my view of Donald Trump the man is mixed at best - I think he's astonishingly resilient and determined, but I also believe he is a narcissist (as many political leaders are) and I think some of the comments he makes are cringeworthy.

What does seem to be the case is that Trump has tapped into a feeling amongst a huge group of Americans that so-called progressive politics isn't working for them, and I certainly understand and agree with that. Even if we run with your view that a significant element of Trump's support are racist white people, he still would not have reached the White House - twice - without the ultimately decisive support of a growing number of minority group voters who the Democrats have traditionally and perhaps arrogantly regarded as 'their' property. It may well be that their votes for Trump represented more of a rejection of the Democrats rather than an enthusiastic endorsement of the Republican candidate, but if the response of the Democrats is to tell these people how stupid they all are, and what traitors they've all been to their heritage/gender etc., instead of analysing why Democrat policies failed working class voters across the board, then don't be surprised if even more minority group voters cross the political divide in the future.

Trump will only be a factor for a short time longer because of his age and the limitations on Presidential terms, but the movement he has spearheaded is likely to have a far longer shelf-life and could be taken forward by more politically astute leaders.