Quote Originally Posted by MadAmster View Post
Trump is a bully. We can all agree with that, I believe.

Putin is a tyrant. We can all agree with that, I believe.

The history.

Georgia. They voted in a pro western government and said they wanted to join both the EU and NATO. EU was positive, I don't know about NATO. Russia invaded.

Ukraine. They voted in a pro western government and said they wanted to join both the EU and NATO. EU was positive, as was NATO although NATO did say, eventually. Russia invaded.

Russia annexed the Crimea in 2014. Illegally I may add. A couple of months later they recruited the Wagner Group to take the Eastern provinces of Ukraine. That way Putin wasn't actually invading Ukraine, it was the WG doing it with weapons Russia supplied. 2022, WG aren't getting very far so Putin goes in. 2025, it's still going on.

Did both Georgia and Ukraine have the right to want to join the EU. Hell, yes. Idem ditto NATO.

In the years following the Russian annexing of the Ukraine, there have been >20 cease fires agreed. All have been broken by... you guessed it, Russia.

Now, USA focus is shifting and is becoming Russia facing rather than Europe facing. Added into that there's also a bucketful of I'll stamp on anything and anyone who doesn't lie down and beg cos I'm a big kid and I always want to get my way. Why this 180 degree turnaround? Recently, 2 former KGB agents, Shvets and Mussayev, have both gone on record saying that the KGB recruited Trump in 1987. That needs investigating, thoroughly. If true, Trump going Russian is no surprise.

There's an article I read earlier which I can't now find in which the author pointed out, I think it was, 7 ways in which Trump and Vance gaslit Zelensky. I felt the author got it spot on.
I think your point that bullies should be met with equal force applies in the current predicament, but also my point that that doesn’t work when such equal force is not available. IMO NATO > Russia, NATO-USA<Russia