New Signings

[hopelesslyoptimistic]

The best managers manage playing time but also pick games and moments to blood and progress youngsters.

Surely you are not saying Farke is good at squad rotation, squad development and subs.

I?ve acknowledged his success last year and that he is doing well given the challenges this. Surely that does not mean we have to venerate every aspect of what he does.

Young players typically have specific development plans which if they are good enough the senior coaches carry on to how they can be given a chance to swim and develop in a bigger pond.

Farke seems to concentrate solely on the first team and react to injuries or form before other break in. In that regard he is playing 2D chess when the better ones are playing in 3D chess.

He seems thin skinned too and won?t take comments from young players which is more a reflection on him than them.

[MrsORichSenior_]

The best managers manage playing time but also pick games and moments to blood and progress youngsters.

Surely you are not saying Farke is good at squad rotation, squad development and subs.

I?ve acknowledged his success last year and that he is doing well given the challenges this. Surely that does not mean we have to venerate every aspect of what he does.

Young players typically have specific development plans which if they are good enough the senior coaches carry on to how they can be given a chance to swim and develop in a bigger pond.

Farke seems to concentrate solely on the first team and react to injuries or form before other break in. In that regard he is playing 2D chess when the better ones are playing in 3D chess.

He seems thin skinned too and won?t take comments from young players which is more a reflection on him than them.

i understand your point of view but..... i do not agree with it...😬

1.The best managers manage playing time but also pick games and moments to blood and progress youngsters ?

this stage of our current PL season is NOT the time to blood youngsters.....

2.Surely you are not saying Farke is good at squad rotation, squad development and subs ?

time will tell..... as THIS PL season progresses.

3.I?ve acknowledged his success last year and that he is doing well given the challenges this. Surely that does not mean we have to venerate every aspect of what he does ?

i am commenting on our maiden PL season NOW...... with the goal being survival with the remnants of last years squad and our new arrivals been bought in to do a specific job in helping that aim.

4.Young players typically have specific development plans which if they are good enough the senior coaches carry on to how they can be given a chance to swim and develop in a bigger pond ?

young players have AGREED development plans.... this season requires seasoned pros to get the job done...... and good coaches will want to see good young ones play weekly games to develop without the stress of PL sink or swim performances blighting their development programme.

5.Farke seems to concentrate solely on the first team and react to injuries or form before other break in. In that regard he is playing 2D chess when the better ones are playing in 3D chess.

Farke is a PL coach fully focused on achieving winning football results for our club..... we have invested in short term age groups that should be good enough to do the job required when they are given a chance.

6.He seems thin skinned too and won?t take comments from young players which is more a reflection on him than them.

how do you know that ?
how do you know what happens in his office ?

the club operates a system into deducing who fits the bill as a Leeds United player, several coaches are involved in player feed back from the training pitches....... skills help but so does personality which must be team integrated... and marked by a unified control of all aspects needed to be a professional footballer....

as from early training regimes....starting from development of the early physical and mental players raw materials right through to the final distribution of a finished fully focused player....... if you cannot fully perform into what is being asked for or expected from you..... then its sink or swim......

not every young footballer is a guaranteed winner who can play on the big stages.... and giving a young talent a 5 minute cameo appearances this season for a Leeds side currently trying to establish itself at the highest level.... such a situation will not happen in this seasons PL.

MOT

[hopelesslyoptimistic]

i understand your point of view but..... i do not agree with it...😬

1.The best managers manage playing time but also pick games and moments to blood and progress youngsters ?

this stage of our current PL season is NOT the time to blood youngsters.....

2.Surely you are not saying Farke is good at squad rotation, squad development and subs ?

time will tell..... as THIS PL season progresses.

3.I?ve acknowledged his success last year and that he is doing well given the challenges this. Surely that does not mean we have to venerate every aspect of what he does ?

i am commenting on our maiden PL season NOW...... with the goal being survival with the remnants of last years squad and our new arrivals been bought in to do a specific job in helping that aim.

4.Young players typically have specific development plans which if they are good enough the senior coaches carry on to how they can be given a chance to swim and develop in a bigger pond ?

young players have AGREED development plans.... this season requires seasoned pros to get the job done...... and good coaches will want to see good young ones play weekly games to develop without the stress of PL sink or swim performances blighting their development programme.

5.Farke seems to concentrate solely on the first team and react to injuries or form before other break in. In that regard he is playing 2D chess when the better ones are playing in 3D chess.

Farke is a PL coach fully focused on achieving winning football results for our club..... we have invested in short term age groups that should be good enough to do the job required when they are given a chance.

6.He seems thin skinned too and won?t take comments from young players which is more a reflection on him than them.

how do you know that ?
how do you know what happens in his office ?

the club operates a system into deducing who fits the bill as a Leeds United player, several coaches are involved in player feed back from the training pitches....... skills help but so does personality which must be team integrated... and marked by a unified control of all aspects needed to be a professional footballer....

as from early training regimes....starting from development of the early physical and mental players raw materials right through to the final distribution of a finished fully focused player....... if you cannot fully perform into what is being asked for or expected from you..... then its sink or swim......

not every young footballer is a guaranteed winner who can play on the big stages.... and giving a young talent a 5 minute cameo appearances this season for a Leeds side currently trying to establish itself at the highest level.... such a situation will not happen in this seasons PL.

MOT

Probably best to agree to disagree as a lot of the points being made are not really very specific to what I am saying or are not things I disagree with but seem to suggest I am.

If he keeps us up great and he is a relative genius but in comparison to most of the coaches in the PL he doesn?t necessarily compare that well on many fronts.

The best managers tend to be less binary in approach.

[MrsORichSenior_]

Probably best to agree to disagree as a lot of the points being made are not really very specific to what I am saying or are not things I disagree with but seem to suggest I am.

If he keeps us up great and he is a relative genius but in comparison to most of the coaches in the PL he doesn?t necessarily compare that well on many fronts.

The best managers tend to be less binary in approach.

which coaches..... at which clubs.... and what revenue streams do they work from and how long have their clubs been actually established in PL..... as a matter of interest....... would be my final counter offer for middle ground.......regarding Farke after only a handful of games.

MOT

[spaldy]

Some good points both good and bad on Farke

Simpleminded that I am?.. Biggest fear I have is we end up with another Ted.😳

We do know what Farke can do and the team generally seems to play for him. I do think we are good enough to survive which is the most important thing first year back

[ozleeds]

which coaches..... at which clubs.... and what revenue streams do they work from and how long have their clubs been actually established in PL..... as a matter of interest....... would be my final counter offer for middle ground.......regarding Farke after only a handful of games.

MOT

Hold on, he's been there 3 years and took a club arguably the best championship squad into not getting promotion, then next season he did it with the best squad in probably the worst ever championship. His record at top division clubs is nothing short of crap. His dissensions on the game day squad and talk are not what he preaches, and he tends to do it one way, and we all know how it will end up. Full of excuses to cover his mistakes. The Premier League is unforgiving and we all know how corrupt it is, so if you don't have someone special, you don't survive, just ask all the outgoing managers every year and they are miles better than Mr. Farke. I respect your views and others, but what Hope is saying is 100% right in my eyes, and nothing will change it.

[ozleeds]

Some good points both good and bad on Farke

Simpleminded that I am?.. Biggest fear I have is we end up with another Ted.��

We do know what Farke can do and the team generally seems to play for him. I do think we are good enough to survive which is the most important thing first year back

But they don't, you may think they do, but behind the scenes, it's not rainbows and glitter. He has destroyed quite a few talented players whom some have recovered in other teams, but some are scared for life. I get it's not his fault the 49ers are the main blame, and again I stress, unless Red Bull takes full control, we will be a nothing club. As for surviving like you, I hope that again I say to myself what for if it's going to be the same next season and the one after.

[hopelesslyoptimistic]

which coaches..... at which clubs.... and what revenue streams do they work from and how long have their clubs been actually established in PL..... as a matter of interest....... would be my final counter offer for middle ground.......regarding Farke after only a handful of games.

MOT

Pretty much every other team and coach in the PL. I have looked at the stats for about 12 clubs ranging for Arsenal, Liverpool and City at one end to Burnley and Spam at the other and Sunderland, Fulham and Bournemouth in between.

What is fairly consistent is that those clubs make at least 4 subs each game and a lot more typically 5 and they make the subs at lot earlier.

Some at half time to change the game but often around the 60th minute.

Arsenal and city often make half time subs (and more than one).

We consistently make fewer and later subs than other teams. A lot of our subs are in the from the 78th minutes or between 80 and 90 minutes.

The game has deeper benches with up to 5 subs.

We don’t use it for impact and we don’t use it to rotate enough - most of those other clubs do.

Farke’s record is fairly mediocre and Leeds had the best squad in each of the last two seasons - last year by a mile so he was expected to get us up.

Increasingly, he talks about his own exploits as a striker as if he understands DCL etc. His record was decent but he was playing a lot in regional (which no longer exist) not national football so equivalent to L2 here at best but more likely the national league division 2.

When he speaks he often talks about himself which comes across to me as insure or narcissistic.

He is a decent coach and has found a niche in the leagues below the top league. It seems in the top league his flaws get exposed.

As I have said elsewhere, I’ve been fairly impressed with what he has done so far but that doesn’t mean he hasn’t got a lot of improving to do.

If you are a young player you don’t sign for Leeds to break through - he has said publicly several times he likes youngsters on the bench but not on the pitch. A lot of talented 16 and 17 year olds left this summer including some to spurs. I don’t think any of that is a co-incidence.

The game has moved on and I’m not sure he has caught up. The way he speaks to and treats some players I really really don’t like.

[MrsORichSenior_]

Pretty much every other team and coach in the PL. I have looked at the stats for about 12 clubs ranging for Arsenal, Liverpool and City at one end to Burnley and Spam at the other and Sunderland, Fulham and Bournemouth in between.

What is fairly consistent is that those clubs make at least 4 subs each game and a lot more typically 5 and they make the subs at lot earlier.

Some at half time to change the game but often around the 60th minute.

Arsenal and city often make half time subs (and more than one).

We consistently make fewer and later subs than other teams. A lot of our subs are in the from the 78th minutes or between 80 and 90 minutes.

The game has deeper benches with up to 5 subs.

We don’t use it for impact and we don’t use it to rotate enough - most of those other clubs do.

Farke’s record is fairly mediocre and Leeds had the best squad in each of the last two seasons - last year by a mile so he was expected to get us up.

Increasingly, he talks about his own exploits as a striker as if he understands DCL etc. His record was decent but he was playing a lot in regional (which no longer exist) not national football so equivalent to L2 here at best but more likely the national league division 2.

When he speaks he often talks about himself which comes across to me as insure or narcissistic.

He is a decent coach and has found a niche in the leagues below the top league. It seems in the top league his flaws get exposed.

As I have said elsewhere, I’ve been fairly impressed with what he has done so far but that doesn’t mean he hasn’t got a lot of improving to do.

If you are a young player you don’t sign for Leeds to break through - he has said publicly several times he likes youngsters on the bench but not on the pitch. A lot of talented 16 and 17 year olds left this summer including some to spurs. I don’t think any of that is a co-incidence.

The game has moved on and I’m not sure he has caught up. The way he speaks to and treats some players I really really don’t like.

to summarise...... early days for Farkes newly introduced base 4-3-3..... which he has changed from the effective based 4-2-3-1 used successfully last season .... which is encouraging......not to defensive and allows quicker build-ups.....with the defensive shape kept well within it.... helped by an improved more physical midfield.......

but someone had to give way for our present PL early days set up....... so it was the Tanaka silky skills that were benched.... for now anyway......... a decision made in my eyes due to our increased focus on intensity when out of possession...... an area that our metrics dept decided Tanaka was a weak link....... as we do like to play direct for Lewin.

so i do see Farke as indeed having supplied detailed further greater tactical flexibility in our Premier League approach so far..... using what he had available for the individual match opponents we have played..... so far.

all done with trying to play football with an attacking mentality currently....... which should be applauded....... as playing such football comes with risks...... but it suits the majority of our present players skills level..... and fans in the main like it.....

if certain goal chances had been taken...... i am sure that you would still not be happy with him at our helm..... looking at substitution timings of other PL teams then 60 plus minutes is the norm from what i have been shown....... but i do not personally think we should have been chasing any of our past tight games by changing players...... as we are not quite good enough yet as an experienced team unit yet..... maybe another 5 games will tighten that aspect of really knowing one another on the pitch.... for me we have to keep it real and in perspective.

but its great that objective spectacled eyes can bring alternate views into debates to express opinions... for consideration and done with respect...... enjoy your weekend and stay safe.

MOT

👀 maybe a decent weekend read for you J.......about how the peoples game fell into the hands of the wealthy global elite..... and what does that mean for the fans left behind.......
investigative journalist Aidrian Goldberg and big Baggies fan.......uncovers how English football was transformed from a community asset into a globalised, billion pound business through the murky trails of club ownership, political compromise and regulatory failure.....

[hopelesslyoptimistic]

to summarise...... early days for Farkes newly introduced base 4-3-3..... which he has changed from the effective based 4-2-3-1 used successfully last season .... which is encouraging......not to defensive and allows quicker build-ups.....with the defensive shape kept well within it.... helped by an improved more physical midfield.......

but someone had to give way for our present PL early days set up....... so it was the Tanaka silky skills that were benched.... for now anyway......... a decision made in my eyes due to our increased focus on intensity when out of possession...... an area that our metrics dept decided Tanaka was a weak link....... as we do like to play direct for Lewin.

so i do see Farke as indeed having supplied detailed further greater tactical flexibility in our Premier League approach so far..... using what he had available for the individual match opponents we have played..... so far.

all done with trying to play football with an attacking mentality currently....... which should be applauded....... as playing such football comes with risks...... but it suits the majority of our present players skills level..... and fans in the main like it.....

if certain goal chances had been taken...... i am sure that you would still not be happy with him at our helm..... looking at substitution timings of other PL teams then 60 plus minutes is the norm from what i have been shown....... but i do not personally think we should have been chasing any of our past tight games by changing players...... as we are not quite good enough yet as an experienced team unit yet..... maybe another 5 games will tighten that aspect of really knowing one another on the pitch.... for me we have to keep it real and in perspective.

but its great that objective spectacled eyes can bring alternate views into debates to express opinions... for consideration and done with respect...... enjoy your weekend and stay safe.

MOT

👀 maybe a decent weekend read for you J.......about how the peoples game fell into the hands of the wealthy global elite..... and what does that mean for the fans left behind.......
investigative journalist Aidrian Goldberg and big Baggies fan.......uncovers how English football was transformed from a community asset into a globalised, billion pound business through the murky trails of club ownership, political compromise and regulatory failure.....

I never said Tanaka should start - was saying Farke is rubbish at subs and giving people game time. Said from two games I’ve been at Stach needed subbing at 60 mins and in one game he stayed on and we lost and in another it was about 83 mins.

Look at the stats I looked at every game this season for 12 PL clubs to see when they make subs and those will have included all clubs but for fewer games. We are the slowest to make subs and make them later bar possibly West Ham - Spam are not doing so great.

Read a lot about the game and the changes some of which are inevitable but still sad.

Have a good weekend too and we clearly disagree on Farke’s flaws but the world would be boring if there was nothing to debate. I know you know a few in the inside of the game and at Leeds through work but I do too.