Election Year or Fear!

[ramAnag]

Again para by para

Maybe I didn?’t explain well, by both sides I meant Palestine flag wavers on one side and Cross of St George on the other. Both are a mix of the devout, the misled and the agitators. Note that Palestinians have invaded a homeland and slaughtered civilians, just on a smaller scale

Whataboutery

The ?‘unite the kingdom?’ is partly about being invaded, albeit not by a state, I?’m sure you?’re aware there?’s a widespread sentiment on those lines? I wouldn?’t advocate violence in that case, so no you?’re wrong on that one

Yes ironic and beyond ?‘disappointing?’

(Last three paras) I accept your rationale, but I still think it?’s childish (in anyone). I think Zak Polanski is as big a menace as Robinson in a more subtle and insidious manner but I?’ll respect his right to change his name. Just different standards I guess

Your point about Zak Polanski changing his name is a fair one. I guess he just thought Zak Polanski sounded cooler than David Paulden. It does but it’s all a bit daft.

Beyond that, you may disagree with the Greens as much as the EDL - albeit for entirely different reasons - but the two leaders are hardly on the same scale as far as ‘menace’ is concerned are they? Only one has found fame and relative fortune out of peddling hatred.

[swaledale]

Again para by para

Maybe I didn’t explain well, by both sides I meant Palestine flag wavers on one side and Cross of St George on the other. Both are a mix of the devout, the misled and the agitators. Note that Palestinians have invaded a homeland and slaughtered civilians, just on a smaller scale

Whataboutery

The ‘unite the kingdom’ is partly about being invaded, albeit not by a state, I’m sure you’re aware there’s a widespread sentiment on those lines? I wouldn’t advocate violence in that case, so no you’re wrong on that one

Yes ironic and beyond ‘disappointing’

(Last three paras) I accept your rationale, but I still think it’s childish (in anyone). I think Zak Polanski is as big a menace as Robinson in a more subtle and insidious manner but I’ll respect his right to change his name. Just different standards I guess

Lets get the facts correct, HAMAS invaded Israel and killed civilians. HAMAs is no more representative of the majority of Palestinians, than the IRA (in its former guise) was representative of Irish catholics., or Trump and MAGA are of the majority of Americans. Thats demonstrated by the fact that HAMAS knew what Israel's response would be, but clearly had no thought for the lives of the Palestinians.

Palestinians generally are caught between a rock and hard place, intimidated and treated appallingly by Israel, whilst intimidated and killed/tortured if they dissent by by HAMAS who "govern" them.

I'm aware that certain parts of the population (mostly led by irresponsible politicians and a certain tax exile) have made false claims that the UK is being invaded. How widespread that view is, is difficult to judge accurately, but lets say around 25% hold that view either seriously, or have been led to believe that because of "lazy" thinking.

You have in fact alluded to a an antisemetic trope ironically, which is the “great replacement theory,” whose origins date back to the late 19th century, argues that Jews and some Western elites are conspiring to replace white Americans and Europeans with people of non-European descent, particularly Asians and Africans. I'm quite surprised that you seem happy to perpetuate that trope.

Again its ironic that the places where people seem most worked up about this "subtle invasion" as you not so delicately term it, live in places where on the whole the percentage of immigrants is very low, often under 1%. Which rather suggests that their fear is the result of the rhetoric, rather than than any lived experience.

I accept a fear and distrust of "others" is to an extent a normal human response where people have very limited knowledge and experience of any culture or nationality outside their own. But thats not a reason to pander to it, I distinctly recall back in the late 1970's, recruiting the first black employee at a 100% white organisation and overhearing other employess who were by no means uneducated, saying "She is just like us isn't she?"!

I don't dispute that there should be an honest debate about immigration, which ought to be balanced as to the pro's and con's, insinuating that the Uk is being subtly invaded is not true or helpful.

I remain suspicious of Zak Polanski, though I think your assertion that he is on a par with Yaxley-lennon is very wide of the mark. I rather think your "balanced" view has slipped and perhaps your prejudice is coming to the fore?

He isn't being funded by very dubious, very wealthy right wing agitators. he isn't spreading false racist and xenophobic messages of hate, he hasn't as far as I am aware been convicted of any criminal activity or been associated with acts of violence and intimidation.

He is openly campaigning in a democratic manner, with policies, some of which are clear, others rather opaque in terms of how they would be achieved, I'm sceptical of many but then thats true for any political party, there is always some things one approves of, and others not.

He is offering something different, whether you or anybody else approves is a matter for their personal choice.

[Andy_Faber]

Your point about Zak Polanski changing his name is a fair one. I guess he just thought Zak Polanski sounded cooler than David Paulden. It does but it’s all a bit daft.

Beyond that, you may disagree with the Greens as much as the EDL - albeit for entirely different reasons - but the two leaders are hardly on the same scale as far as ‘menace’ is concerned are they? Only one has found fame and relative fortune out of peddling hatred.

Daft/childish, same territory, it just detracts from whatever point is being made IMO.

Not sure about the second bit - I disagree with the EDL’s methods whatever their beliefs, I accept the Green’s right to have an opinion, just don’t agree with some of them, and increasingly so - and whatever the ‘green leaning’ extremists are called, I’m against them as much as EDL.

I consider Polanski to be a ‘menace’ to a greater part of the population than Farage. I’ve got no view on relative ‘fortune

[Ram Pant]

Whatsisname(s) got an apprenticeship (aircraft engineer) 600 people applied for, and they took four people on". He qualified in 2003 after five years of study, but lost his job when he was convicted of assaulting an off-duty police officer in a drunken argument for which he served a 12-month prison sentence.

The Tommy Robinson from whom Yaxley took his name was a prominent member of the Luton Town MIGs MIGs famous for using Stanlet knives), a football hooligan crew which follows Luton Town. The pseudonym successfully hid his identity and criminal history until the connection was uncovered in July 2010 by Searchlight magazine. He has also used the names Andrew McMaster, Paul Harris, Wayne King, and Stephen Lennon.

It seems Tommy Ten Names is a slight exaggeration. It's only Seven Names... so far. It wouldn't surprise me to find out that the Wayne King pseudonym was chosen because he prefers verbs to nouns

[ramAnag]

Daft/childish, same territory, it just detracts from whatever point is being made IMO.

Not sure about the second bit - I disagree with the EDL?‚?’s methods whatever their beliefs, I accept the Green?‚?’s right to have an opinion, just don?‚?’t agree with some of them, and increasingly so - and whatever the ?‚?‘green leaning?‚?’ extremists are called, I?‚?’m against them as much as EDL.

I consider Polanski to be a ?‚?‘menace?‚?’ to a greater part of the population than Farage. I?‚?’ve got no view on relative ?‚?‘fortune

Perhaps you should have as it’s the bit that matters most. Robinson/Y-L (whoever) is said to be worth between 1 and 3 million GBP. His income has been derived from merchandise, speaking engagements and slightly mysterious international backers. Profit out of hatred.

Disappointing that you differentiate between the EDL’s methods and beliefs. Both are equally sinister and repellent imo.

At the risk of raising the ‘B word’ issue again, but in terms of ‘menace’, can be sure that Polanski has never damaged as many of the UK population as Farage managed with B****t. Of course Farage has, in the process, lined his own pockets even more substantially than TR/Y-L.

[swaledale]

On a different topic, but aligned in that it runs counter to the narrative, Reform and other right wing parties and media like to promote at the moment. I saw this comment online.

"Lost my phone in London, with four credit cards and £150 cash in the case. Returned to me within 21 minutes. This hellhole of a city eh."

[swaledale]

Whatsisname(s) got an apprenticeship (aircraft engineer) 600 people applied for, and they took four people on". He qualified in 2003 after five years of study, but lost his job when he was convicted of assaulting an off-duty police officer in a drunken argument for which he served a 12-month prison sentence.

The Tommy Robinson from whom Yaxley took his name was a prominent member of the Luton Town MIGs MIGs famous for using Stanlet knives), a football hooligan crew which follows Luton Town. The pseudonym successfully hid his identity and criminal history until the connection was uncovered in July 2010 by Searchlight magazine. He has also used the names Andrew McMaster, Paul Harris, Wayne King, and Stephen Lennon.

It seems Tommy Ten Names is a slight exaggeration. It's only Seven Names... so far. It wouldn't surprise me to find out that the Wayne King pseudonym was chosen because he prefers verbs to nouns

I think we can agree, that irrespective of the political spectrum one's views are, Yaxley-lennon is a thorughly nasty and disreputable person who has no positive impact on the society in which we live. Any person mounting a defence of, or expressing sympathy (however slight) with his views and actions, really needs to take a long look at themselves.

Polanski, however odd some of his views might be, they are hardly a threat to society, some are even sensible but he is not even in the same league as Yaxley-lennon and if you don't like his or The Greens Policies, don't vote for them, its that simple. Although in the next GE, I'd certainly consider them in a tactical vote if it meant stopping Reform who are the real threat to society.

[Andy_Faber]

On a different topic, but aligned in that it runs counter to the narrative, Reform and other right wing parties and media like to promote at the moment. I saw this comment online.

"Lost my phone in London, with four credit cards and £150 cash in the case. Returned to me within 21 minutes. This hellhole of a city eh."

Just an anecdote Swale, we can all find/invent anecdotes that fit our narrative

[Andy_Faber]

I think we can agree

Polanski, however odd some of his views might be, they are hardly a threat to society

I'm afraid we can't

[SithHappens]

Just an anecdote Swale, we can all find/invent anecdotes that fit our narrative

We can, like Nigel did when he read out the supposed real letter saying what a marvelous chao he was at school and not at all racist.