⚽ Match Thread vs. Barrow 07.10.23 [EFL L2]

[drillerpie]

Oh dear, oh dear....back again (as King Charles said to Liz Truss )

Here's the key...The Reedtz brothers arrived pledging attacking and entertaining football. The amazing thing is that they actually meant it!

[traditionally, that declaration is the football equivalent of a UK PM saying they'll govern for everyone, Theresa May as the champion of 'the just about managing'. Most new owners and managers tend to promise attacking and entertaining and then proceed to serve up exactly the opposite]

NA and IB didn't quite have the courage to implement the Reedtz vision (i.e. Kelly-Evans playing in place of Nemane, Turner as NA's first LCB when he had Chicksen), but under LW we've seen...

- a 3-2-4-1 formation, practically
- the high line and press
- positive team selection that sees Jones, Nemane, Austin in the wide slots. Midfielders who are technical rather than physical

Everyone can see that this iteration of Notts is different to what went before. We've really gone for it.

The opposite might be a solid 4-4-2 or a 5-3-1-1 we've seen under Curle, Derry etc. In these cases the front men are isolated, their shot and scoring rates suffer. Without support, front men can look very ordinary and the moaners might start on them.

Well this applies in reverse with attacking approaches. defenders can be left exposed and isolated. There just aren't the numbers or structure you'd have with 2 banks of 4 for example. In the defensive approach, pass up to a lone attacker who's easily dispossessed is a display of losing football. But a counter-attack in space against the last of our back-line is just another display of winning football. This is because winning teams mostly attack and losing teams mostly defend. As a general rule, set yourself up to mostly defend and you'll mostly lose and vice versa.

Kudos to everyone at the club for its determination to implement positive, entertaining football. You might think the biggest reward has been the results, but it's probably the doubling ofthe gate instead. Although it's measured and possession-based, I don't think we've seen a more attack-minded approach, in terms of selection and formation, not even under Moniz or all those years back under Wilko.

It's radical and it does look unfamiliar and different to what we've seen before. Some fans seem to be freaked out by how exposed and shaky at the back we can look as we're trying to play out or dominate and pin teams back. This is probably the source of all the moaning about our defenders. Hopefully the negative noise at selected targets will be drowned out by the thousands who turn up now to watch entertaining, attacking football.

I'm glad you had fun writing that, and thank you for the pitted history of the club I've supported for decades and watch every week.

Not sure what I'm supposed to respond to there though?

Who said anything about LW criticising or not criticising the captain?

'no evidence to say he never criticises him' what kind of contortion is that?

And where did 'route 1' come from? The red herrings seem to be all yours.

Your whole point is that our players, particularly defenders, should be above criticism.

Among the reasons you have cited for this are:

The system we play

The fact that they had an amazing season last year

The fact that we are top of the table this year

The assertion that if they are exposed to criticism it might take away their mojo

I pointed out that luckily our manager doesnt see it that way, (meaning if they don't play well he criticises them in his interviews, sometimes quite heavily). Your answer to that was that he picks them (Cameron, for example) every week. I replied that he is correct in doing that but picking them doesn't mean he doesn't criticise them.

Simple as that really and not too difficult to understand IMO.

[Mud Pie]

I thought KC had a mixed performance on Saturday and said so. I also hope and fully expect him to start against the Stags.

[the_anticlough]

I'm glad you had fun writing that, and thank you for the pitted history of the club I've supported for decades and watch every week.

Not sure what I'm supposed to respond to there though?

You're welcome.
But you misread there. It wasn't a history. It was an answer to the claim that the defenders aren't tasked with more responsibility than in more conventional teams. They are. When play breaks down, most certainly 2 or 3 defenders have to defend the width of the pitch until others get back. It was also an explanation why some fans might not recognise or like that - it's a big departure from the football served up over the decades.

A team that has such an attack-minded approach will have some in-built defensive vulnerabilities. It's always a trade-off, but for us a very successful one - in terms of results, promotion, attendances, revenue and image etc.

Your whole point is that our players, particularly defenders, should be above criticism.

Among the reasons you have cited for this are:

The system we play

The fact that they had an amazing season last year

The fact that we are top of the table this year

The assertion that if they are exposed to criticism it might take away their mojo

Nooooooooo - but it shouldn't surprise me that I've been exchanging emails based on a complete misreading of my 'whole point'

'above criticism' is not a position anybody could ever reach.

Fans, posters, want to criticise, they will - their right to if they want.

But if other posters see that criticism as unfair, imbalanced or wrong, the right applies there as well to put that case - a typical messageboard exchange.

I pointed out that luckily our manager doesnt see it that way, (meaning if they don't play well he criticises them in his interviews, sometimes quite heavily). Your answer to that was that he picks them (Cameron, for example) every week. I replied that he is correct in doing that but picking them doesn't mean he doesn't criticise them.

Well, I think you'd struggle to find examples of LW criticising individual players' performances, or even criticism of just a unit of the team. In fact, in some of his more critical interviews, he's said that the problem with poor play hasn't been at the back where play might have broken down, but in the options ahead. Or actions ahead that led to the defence being put under pressure when it was avoidable

That's pretty much the limit of what's been put out there publicly. In-house criticism will rightly remain a complete mystery to fans.

[the_anticlough]

I would have Kelly Evans any day of the week over Nemane. At least he could tackle and didnt get knocked off the ball with a puff of wind...

You must use Cntl+ F and type in Nemane, Duzza

The point was about the general approach, not the individual qualities. Kelly Evans was a fine full-back

[SaltySeaDog]

Kelly Evans was a fine full-back

I see that Dion is currently without a club. Hope he picks something up soon

[BJPIE]

You're welcome.
But you misread there. It wasn't a history. It was an answer to the claim that the defenders aren't tasked with more responsibility than in more conventional teams. They are. When play breaks down, most certainly 2 or 3 defenders have to defend the width of the pitch until others get back. It was also an explanation why some fans might not recognise or like that - it's a big departure from the football served up over the decades.

A team that has such an attack-minded approach will have some in-built defensive vulnerabilities. It's always a trade-off, but for us a very successful one - in terms of results, promotion, attendances, revenue and image etc.



Nooooooooo - but it shouldn't surprise me that I've been exchanging emails based on a complete misreading of my 'whole point'

'above criticism' is not a position anybody could ever reach.

Fans, posters, want to criticise, they will - their right to if they want.

But if other posters see that criticism as unfair, imbalanced or wrong, the right applies there as well to put that case - a typical messageboard exchange.



Well, I think you'd struggle to find examples of LW criticising individual players' performances, or even criticism of just a unit of the team. In fact, in some of his more critical interviews, he's said that the problem with poor play hasn't been at the back where play might have broken down, but in the options ahead. Or actions ahead that led to the defence being put under pressure when it was avoidable

That's pretty much the limit of what's been put out there publicly. In-house criticism will rightly remain a complete mystery to fans.

Are you suggesting Camerons miserable back pass at Sutton was a result of actions further upfield. That Brindleys refusal on more than one occassion to engage attackers and position himself between ball and goal when he has eons of time to do so is somehow someone else's mistake????

They are glaring and obvious defensive failings. I'm certain LW sees it that way and will rightly keep his comments in the dressing room.

We do not have to nor should we. This a messageboard for opinion. Its piss poor defending at times.

[Proactive not Reactive]

I would have Kelly Evans any day of the week over Nemane. At least he could tackle and didnt get knocked off the ball with a puff of wind...

.... and there in a sentence is why you're not the Head Coach ... thank goodness

[durhampie]

.... and there in a sentence is why you're not the Head Coach ... thank goodness

Its just my personnel opinion. Having had the privilege of watching both players home and away, and not from highlights or dodgy streaming..
Stick that up your pulpit...

[The_Don_ORiordan]

Are you suggesting Camerons miserable back pass at Sutton was a result of actions further upfield. That Brindleys refusal on more than one occassion to engage attackers and position himself between ball and goal when he has eons of time to do so is somehow someone else's mistake????

They are glaring and obvious defensive failings. I'm certain LW sees it that way and will rightly keep his comments in the dressing room.

We do not have to nor should we. This a messageboard for opinion. It’s piss poor defending at times.

And that last line hits the nail on the head.

Some of the goals are understandable, we are an attacking team. But some are due to very poor defending and players wherever they play need to perform.

We’ll sign at least one defender who plays regularly in the Jan window. Because surely no one would disagree we need to improve this area.

[ncfcog]

NCS Shorts E# 11.
Barrow, Derby and Stags all discussed.

https://www.ncs-news.co.uk/read/derby-x2