Maurice Ross Sacked

[Borg elite]

I've given my opinion laxton, that's why I wanted a count, no amount of debates going to change some minds, so not WRONG.

[laddo]

Actually try living in Ireland & being English in Republican areas like I have. You will always get one or two that pass remarks. Do I cry? No

But equally important do you get angry?

Borg is adamant of having a count on this topic, maybe Elite can run one of his polls and everyone who wants to vote can vote

Racist or not racist?
Sackable offence or not?
Care or don't care?

[irishpete]

But equally important do you get angry?

Borg is adamant of having a count on this topic, maybe Elite can run one of his polls and everyone who wants to vote can vote

Racist or not racist?
Sackable offence or not?
Care or don't care?

Why would I get angry? Like I said. You will always get the odd one or two
I am what I am, English n proud, will never change that!!

[Borg elite]

Try being Irish in some parts of Ireland Pete, like my family, it's not so bad as it used to be but that's not hard . That's better laxton, it's just out of interest.

[PedroTheFisherman66]

To be fair he didn't call him African, he humorously queried whether he had a doctored African passport in reference to the number (comparatively small in relation to the total number of African players, comparatively large in relation to players from other continents) of famous suspected cases of this from sub-Saharan Africa. Neither did he imply that 'all African players have doctored passports', as has been previously suggested.

This happens in sub-Saharan Africa because the state bureaucracy is less developed than in the Maghreb. Many births are registered years afterwards, if at all, which can lead to some flexibility in the official date of birth.

If we want to get technical about it, the players with the passports in question will have had the same kind of skin pigmentation as Enzio, and I don't think he was seriously implying that Enzio has a doctored passport, or that Enzio was born in Africa, but the fact remains that he used Enzio's skin colour as the premise for a joke, which is inadvisable as a line manager in a work context, especially with people you haven't known for long.

How would Doyle react to a joke using Irish stereotypes? He might find it funny, he might not find it funny but it would be water of a duck's back, or he might take offence, perhaps even extreme offence. He might be ok with it if said directly to him with a smile, but less so if it was said behind his back while he was playing, as part of comments critical of his performance. Unless you know the person well enough to know they'llbe ok with it, you have to err on the side of caution, which Ross seems to have acknowledged.

As I've said before, I don't think it's impossible for this kind of joke to be taken in good spirits, but your judgement needs to be spot on in terms of when, where and with whom.

I think a lot of this boils down to details like the context things like this are said in, what you're used to in terms of things like social class, work environment etc. Some people on here clearly see it as a bit of banter, and they are probably used to environments where you get the piss ripped out of you for any distinguishing features whatsoever, and comments relating to nationality or skin colour would pass unobserved. Others may be used to more sophisticated environments where this kind of comment is the height of embarrassment.

I like this synopsis and think sums it up perfectly.
So if it was a racist remark (depending on your perspective ) was it a remark worthy of sacking or resignation.
I'm sure there are much more derogatory remarks worthy of the sack.
And to be honest the insult in his remark was aimed at his mobility or lack of it.
Maybe he would have been better of saying something like hes seen captain tom move quicker than our enzio and that's even since hes passed away...!
Sorted this takes away any element of pigmentation and makes the insult more focused on the point as opposed to colour.
However throw in the word African it seems to take on a different context completely.
The jibe become more about race than his immobility, I'm not sure why but I think driller has nailed it
Background,experience,environment and context.
For me It might ...might have an element of racism but not one that should have caused the soap opera that has followed.
Does the point Ross was trying to make stand up..?
The one that enzio isnt very mobile..?

[LaxtonLad]

Try being Irish in some parts of Ireland Pete, like my family, it's not so bad as it used to be but that's not hard . That's better laxton, it's just out of interest.

OK Borg, case not closed, eh? But now, just out of interest, don't you think those who vote `racist` will be labelled `snowflakes`? Or those voting `non-racist` called `racists`? Polls like this generally descend into strawman labelling, "People like you...etc." and "You're the type of person...etc." or "I was once like you but...".

[PedroTheFisherman66]

So this is all Enzio’s fault? Right. The fact several players went to Turner and not just one to raise their concerns with him is irrelevant to you. You have based your opinion on his form as a footballer rather than the fact he WAS subjected to derogatory comment.
If Doyle or any player, coach or manager is giving ‘home truths’ their is clearly a line not to be crossed.
If I called you a pr1ck it would clearly be offensive. However you are just a pr1ck. If I called you <any colour, nationality, ***uality etc> Pr1ck, then it’s more prejudice.
In this case their is an argument for and against what the outcome for MR was. Maybe he did resign as he felt that he couldn’t repair multiple bridges in a short space and crucial time of our season. The assumption was he pushed.

Never said it was enzios fault or was down to his current form.i think that might have been in the mind of Ross when he made it as the remark was purely around his movement.
I just dont think it was racist or if it is considered rascist if it was worthy of someone losing his job.
The point of his remark was that enzios movement was poor and as such maybe they could have both focused on that in training after a war of words.
Ps I've been called much worse and have been a victim of racism I'm not trolling as was suggested but just trying to get others perspective.(I think a post from driller nailed this point earlier)
For me I find it a was a poor joke to emphasise a flaw in the way he plays or was playing in the eyes of Ross.

[Biker9999]

Someone on the board said where is biker and others after the win, they have gone silent. Well I remain unconvinced about ownership and leadership but will be happy to say I was wrong when promotion happens this year.

However that’s not what I am here to post about. John Cleese recently left this country to live abroad saying what an awful place Britain had become where unless you agreed with the generally accepted opinion you were unable to say anything outside that narrow view point. I consider the sacking of Ross completely unacceptable and a reflection of our politically correct society and a poor reflection on our owners. And while we are at it the taking of the knee is nothing more than pandering to another politically correct notion. Football authorities could and should have done a lot more a lot earlier. Where are the massive fines and points deductions which should have taken place years ago, quietly pushed aside for “the good of the game”. I dislike racism of any kind but our current politically correct attitude is also unacceptable and is typified by the sacking of Ross. This is my last post as I am done with this board and after 50 years Notts as well. Bye Bye

[LaxtonLad]

Someone on the board said where is biker and others after the win, they have gone silent. Well I remain unconvinced about ownership and leadership but will be happy to say I was wrong when promotion happens this year.

However that’s not what I am here to post about. John Cleese recently left this country to live abroad saying what an awful place Britain had become where unless you agreed with the generally accepted opinion you were unable to say anything outside that narrow view point. I consider the sacking of Ross completely unacceptable and a reflection of our politically correct society and a poor reflection on our owners. And while we are at it the taking of the knee is nothing more than pandering to another politically correct notion. Football authorities could and should have done a lot more a lot earlier. Where are the massive fines and points deductions which should have taken place years ago, quietly pushed aside for “the good of the game”. I dislike racism of any kind but our current politically correct attitude is also unacceptable and is typified by the sacking of Ross. This is my last post as I am done with this board and after 50 years Notts as well. Bye Bye

Don't forget to flounce.

[BigFatPie]

Someone on the board said where is biker and others after the win, they have gone silent. Well I remain unconvinced about ownership and leadership but will be happy to say I was wrong when promotion happens this year.

However that’s not what I am here to post about. John Cleese recently left this country to live abroad saying what an awful place Britain had become where unless you agreed with the generally accepted opinion you were unable to say anything outside that narrow view point. I consider the sacking of Ross completely unacceptable and a reflection of our politically correct society and a poor reflection on our owners. And while we are at it the taking of the knee is nothing more than pandering to another politically correct notion. Football authorities could and should have done a lot more a lot earlier. Where are the massive fines and points deductions which should have taken place years ago, quietly pushed aside for “the good of the game”. I dislike racism of any kind but our current politically correct attitude is also unacceptable and is typified by the sacking of Ross. This is my last post as I am done with this board and after 50 years Notts as well. Bye Bye

Bye.