O/T:- Vaccines: Pro/Anti & Conspiracy Theories [Originally Covid Pass and Meadow Ln.]

[Chicken Balti Pie]

All medical treatments will have reactions and side effects. These current vaccines have a variety that range from mild and common (local injection site soreness, cold/flu type symptoms) to very rare but dangerous (myocarditis, Guillian Barre Syndrome, blood clots). It is up to each individual to make an informed decision as to whether they want to take the risk of disease or risk of vaccine side effects. This is why I find Vaccine Mandates horrific, if there was no risk from the vaccine, then perhaps I'd be less concerned but there are plenty of risks from this vaccine, although small, there are still risks! Forcing people either through legislation or public shaming is totally and utterly unethical.

I personally weighed up the risks and am fully vaccinated, but if someone says to me that the risks for them outweigh the benefits (and that is actually a case here, see why the AZ jab was not offered to the under 40s!) then as long as it's informed and they don't go on about lizard people or some weird stuff, I respect their decision and applaud their courage. A young, fit professional athlete probably has more to risk having the vaccine than getting Covid hence why take up is so low in those demographics but this is not a simple black and white decision that everyone seems to think is the case

[Riverleeno]

All medical treatments will have reactions and side effects. These current vaccines have a variety that range from mild and common (local injection site soreness, cold/flu type symptoms) to very rare but dangerous (myocarditis, Guillian Barre Syndrome, blood clots). It is up to each individual to make an informed decision as to whether they want to take the risk of disease or risk of vaccine side effects. This is why I find Vaccine Mandates horrific, if there was no risk from the vaccine, then perhaps I'd be less concerned but there are plenty of risks from this vaccine, although small, there are still risks! Forcing people either through legislation or public shaming is totally and utterly unethical.

I personally weighed up the risks and am fully vaccinated, but if someone says to me that the risks for them outweigh the benefits (and that is actually a case here, see why the AZ jab was not offered to the under 40s!) then as long as it's informed and they don't go on about lizard people or some weird stuff, I respect their decision and applaud their courage. A young, fit professional athlete probably has more to risk having the vaccine than getting Covid hence why take up is so low in those demographics but this is not a simple black and white decision that everyone seems to think is the case

Good post.

[drillerpie]

All medical treatments will have reactions and side effects. These current vaccines have a variety that range from mild and common (local injection site soreness, cold/flu type symptoms) to very rare but dangerous (myocarditis, Guillian Barre Syndrome, blood clots). It is up to each individual to make an informed decision as to whether they want to take the risk of disease or risk of vaccine side effects. This is why I find Vaccine Mandates horrific, if there was no risk from the vaccine, then perhaps I'd be less concerned but there are plenty of risks from this vaccine, although small, there are still risks! Forcing people either through legislation or public shaming is totally and utterly unethical.

I personally weighed up the risks and am fully vaccinated, but if someone says to me that the risks for them outweigh the benefits (and that is actually a case here, see why the AZ jab was not offered to the under 40s!) then as long as it's informed and they don't go on about lizard people or some weird stuff, I respect their decision and applaud their courage. A young, fit professional athlete probably has more to risk having the vaccine than getting Covid hence why take up is so low in those demographics but this is not a simple black and white decision that everyone seems to think is the case

Pretty much sums up my position too.

[upthemaggies]

So if you're vaxxed you can end up with heart problems induced by either Covid or the vax, with the vax risk increasing with each shot.

If you're not vaxxed then you're only at risk from Covid and 0% risk from a vax, with heart problems suspiciously only now beginning to be emphasised since people started getting jabbed.

[upthemaggies]

On the latest UKHSA Vaccine Surveillance report..... "Unadjusted vaccine effectiveness based on the raw reported infection rates is still negative for all aged between 18 and 70 (see above). In fact, it’s gone negative for the first time in 18-29 year-olds, down to minus-10.1%, after a sharp drop in the last week. A negative vaccine effectiveness means the infection rate per 100,000 people is higher in the vaccinated than the unvaccinated. "

[cher1]

On the latest UKHSA Vaccine Surveillance report..... "Unadjusted vaccine effectiveness based on the raw reported infection rates is still negative for all aged between 18 and 70 (see above). In fact, it’s gone negative for the first time in 18-29 year-olds, down to minus-10.1%, after a sharp drop in the last week. A negative vaccine effectiveness means the infection rate per 100,000 people is higher in the vaccinated than the unvaccinated. "

Where is that in the actual report? Am struggling to find it.

[Old_pie]

So if you're vaxxed you can end up with heart problems induced by either Covid or the vax, with the vax risk increasing with each shot.

If you're not vaxxed then you're only at risk from Covid and 0% risk from a vax, with heart problems suspiciously only now beginning to be emphasised since people started getting jabbed.

You have a fixation with irrationality. The risks from Covid are a lot more than a possibility of a heart problem. I won't bother to identify them all here because you can look it up for yourself. However apart from the fact that for every 32 people that die of Covid (not with Covid - of Covid) 30 have NOT been vaccinated. I played golf with someone a few weeks ago and he had Covid earlier in the year, was in a coma for a week and now has a high risk of permanent lung damage and was struggling somewhat on the course.

Stick to doing your excellent "Up The Maggies" site and leave this stuff to those who have better comprehension skills and are not looking for conspiracy theories at every corner. Please.

Material more suitable for handbags methinks.

[drillerpie]

On the latest UKHSA Vaccine Surveillance report..... "Unadjusted vaccine effectiveness based on the raw reported infection rates is still negative for all aged between 18 and 70 (see above). In fact, it’s gone negative for the first time in 18-29 year-olds, down to minus-10.1%, after a sharp drop in the last week. A negative vaccine effectiveness means the infection rate per 100,000 people is higher in the vaccinated than the unvaccinated. "

I've just been to look at that document:

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...llance-reports

And it's interesting reading. I think it could be useful to judge some of the claims made so far. It's about 50 pages long and I only had a quick look and so didn't find the part you quoted UTM, could you tell me which page it's on? I'm sure if I was more tech savvy I'd be able to search for it myself.

[upthemaggies]

I've just been to look at that document:

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...llance-reports

And it's interesting reading. I think it could be useful to judge some of the claims made so far. It's about 50 pages long and I only had a quick look and so didn't find the part you quoted UTM, could you tell me which page it's on? I'm sure if I was more tech savvy I'd be able to search for it myself.

Here's a graph of the figures since September.




Unadjusted meaning those who haven't had their booster yet and remember the double jabbed still have the green light to go about their normal business.

So it's going to be interesting to see how they persuade the double jabbed to get the 3rd shot. Do they start frightening them with the fact that double jabbed are now filling up the hospitals or do they continue to blame the unjabbed and run the risk of leaving the double jabbed to believe they have enough protection.


Or we can just pretend the figures are made up, run back to a peer reviewed paper published 6 months ago that the double jabbed are protected and it's now a tiny decreasing percentage of a minority of unvaxxed who haven't yet had Covid causing all of the chaos.

[upthemaggies]

Correction: The graph does include boosted. "Unadjusted" is complicated, but obviously it's clear why they are now desperate for people to have the boosters. Double vaxxed are the biggest spreaders.