Atmosphere In English Football

[Rattea]

It's been very nota able in the last 10 years in English football at all levels. It was probably signalled when Keane branded the manure fan the Prawn Sandwich Brigade. Been a topic of debate at Derby but I know from fans of other clubs I speak to that its the same at those clubs.

I've not sampled anything like I did in the 80s and 90s except in the very important games like play offs or against the red dogs and they have even dipped now.

It has made me wonder what the cause is. Is it the raise in prices and over commercialisation of the PL? Have the old school traditional supporters got old and calmed down and gone quiet? Is it those younger fans coming through spend most of their childhood following PL teams and lack the passion? Is it the raise of the corporate side of the game? All seater stadiums although this hasn't blighted other countries?

It has to be something because it's a universal thing in the English game? - [url=http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/29867892]view exter

[FindernRam]

I think most of your points have a bearing and it all adds up.
There are two other aspects to consider as well: 1)TV where you have all the false hype of X-Factor and Strictly which sort of conditions you to stay quiet unless instructed to cheer, and there are more TV games to see and it is hard to get vocal too often in the comfort of your front room.
This behaviour goes with you to live games.
2) Modern football is all tactics and tippy tappy passing, there is little sustained blood and thunder. At the end of the day that what gets the crowd up for it. Dave McKay cleaning out Frannie Lee, Archie running past 5 players in the mud. Rarely happens anymore.

You can appreciate the skill but it is not exciting. A typical game today might be 60% possession with 2 shots on target all game. doesn't get the blood flowing.

[roger_ramjet]

Quite agree Findern. The passion has been coached out of the play and players, who are more mechanical than instinctive. The game has lost its roots and you cannot expect the crowd and a atmosphere to be unaffected by those changes. The game is simply less exciting in general. Plus half the crowd are on their mobiles using Twitter etc!!

In a nutshell, Ratty, you cannot compare crowds of the 80's to nowadays - it's not like for like!

[steviejay]

It's been very nota able in the last 10 years in English football at all levels. It was probably signalled when Keane branded the manure fan the Prawn Sandwich Brigade. Been a topic of debate at Derby but I know from fans of other clubs I speak to that its the same at those clubs.

I've not sampled anything like I did in the 80s and 90s except in the very important games like play offs or against the red dogs and they have even dipped now.

It has made me wonder what the cause is. Is it the raise in prices and over commercialisation of the PL? Have the old school traditional supporters got old and calmed down and gone quiet? Is it those younger fans coming through spend most of their childhood following PL teams and lack the passion? Is it the raise of the corporate side of the game? All seater stadiums although this hasn't blighted other countries?

It has to be something because it's a universal thing in the English game?

The tan

[Rattea]

I think you are right IMO even you roger yes and there isn't a like for like that's very true. It used to be really blood and guts stuff.

Even last year at a Belgium 2nd division game where the football was awful both set of fans were going mad in a half empty small stadium and the atmosphere was great.

The interesting thing is the before kickoff stuff. I forgot about that it's all gone hasn't it totally. I remember going with my grandad and getting in early and feeling it build. How could I forget. I've noticed at other places and even different sports they do this. I was talking to a couple a few months ago at a different sport three hours before kick off that weren't even going to the game and had travelled about 400 miles to just sit outside and soak the atmosphere up. At some places same and different sports they are still in the ground an hour after singing and drinking.

Have we lost it for good? Has the game and the way we watch changed that much?

[Trickytreesreds]

The stadia killed it for me. Every ground had some, if not all standing and these attracted the younger, vocal and image movement brigades.
When they was in full flow, you could even get the seated fans, clapping more and singing.

I think every ground could benefit from safe standing as in Germany etc.

Season ticket only, strategically placed and organised. It would breathe new life into matches.
The lower bridgford is trying that at Forest. The safety idiot doesn't like it and has tried to enforce all sorts of miniscule rules and regs to put it down.

Hillsborough must never be repeated, but lets be honest here, all the measures put in place were to an extreme. Of all the things that killed those fans, it was the fences and locked gates.
Remove that from the equation and 96 people would not have died.
Typical government response, to incompetence.

[Rattea]

I think the seating thing is a red herring as I've been to all seater stadiums with amazing atmosphere. I think it is down to traditions and passion and what's happening on the field.

I actually seen some terraces recently with mo fences or crush barriers. Big ones and the fans going nuts and none gets hurt or does. You are right it's the fences caused that at hillsboro and now it's an excuse. It is a nany state and when people do stand and sing there is an over reaction. That is contributing.

[Akwesasne]

The comfortably off are not noted for their passion.Football used to be affordable available to all if they did so wish. My cricket season ticket only averages me £2 a week over the year, yet my football costs me 5, and that's a cheap pensioners concession. One has only to compare match tickets to cinema tickets which used to be about the same but not now. Also how you do bond with the modern player who next season might be turning out for your hated opponents . At least when a player was at the club for a few years he was treated like one of the family and was for forgiven an odd bad game.

[Semper Rutilus]

I think the seating thing is a red herring as I've been to all seater stadiums with amazing atmosphere. I think it is down to traditions and passion and what's happening on the field.

I actually seen some terraces recently with mo fences or crush barriers. Big ones and the fans going nuts and none gets hurt or does. You are right it's the fences caused that at hillsboro and now it's an excuse. It is a nany state and when people do stand and sing there is an over reaction. That is contributing.

Yes, but when you talk about the 70s, 80s even 90s and passion, you forget we had a major hooliganism problem.

The fact is if we are going to stoke passions, you'll end up with a lot of fights and possibly racial abuse and will see clubs punished left right and centre.

Pricing is too high - look at Germany for instance, a 5 - 10 euro ticket for a Bundesliga ticket is very normal.

But TV money has made salaries go through the roof and tick

[swaledale]

I think the seating thing is a red herring as I've been to all seater stadiums with amazing atmosphere. I think it is down to traditions and passion and what's happening on the field.

I actually seen some terraces recently with mo fences or crush barriers. Big ones and the fans going nuts and none gets hurt or does. You are right it's the fences caused that at hillsboro and now it's an excuse. It is a nany state and when people do stand and sing there is an over reaction. That is contributing.

Yes, but when you talk about the 70s, 80s even 90s and passion, you forget we had a major hooliganism problem.

The fact is if we are going to stoke passions, you'll end up with a lot of fights and possibly racial abuse and will see clubs punished left right and centre.

Pricing is too high - look at Germany for instance, a 5 - 10 euro ticket for a Bundesliga ticket is very normal.

But TV