OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[Trickytreesreds]

Ah, you’re supposing he thinks you might be attracted by something other than the Buddhist temples, tuk tuks, beaches, spectacular scenery and cheap street food.
I wouldn’t know...perhaps you’re being a tad over sensitive.

Not the first time he's done it RA.
If he has something to say, he should have the balls to say it. Bear in mind his answer may very well put a stain on Thai's
But Swale isn't known for respect with his selective abuse.

[ramAnag]

As I say...sure he was just joshing and you’re maybe being just a little over sensitive.
Don’t think he mentioned Thais - or ‘stains’ - for that matter. Just pointed out the ‘red zone’ problem.
Not known for ‘respect with his selective abuse.’ Well, he’s not alone there is he?

[Andy_Faber]

Ah, you’re supposing he thinks you might be attracted by something other than the Buddhist temples, tuk tuks, beaches, spectacular scenery and cheap street food.
I wouldn’t know...perhaps you’re being a tad over sensitive.

He’s done it repeatedly rA, I’ve yellow carded him before for it and he’ll be gone if he gets any more explicit,as it is his comments reflect way worse on him than TTR so I let his comments be their own punishments. TTR hasn’t complained to me about it by the way

[Andy_Faber]

On a serious note, our perpetual bitching might ignore the fact that ‘we’ on this forum may not be the ones most impacted by Brexit - there must be one or more ‘tipping points’ (which I honestly either am not subject to or aren’t aware of) by which a group of people of a particular type will already have been noticeably impacted for good or Ill by Brexit. My ‘positives’ appear not to pass the ‘beyond reasonable doubt test’ (in relation to ACTUAL impacts, not news items) so does anyone have any they can share?

Strangely or maybe Not this was the last half sensible post and still no answer

[ramAnag]

He’s done it repeatedly rA, I’ve yellow carded him before for it and he’ll be gone if he gets any more explicit,as it is his comments reflect way worse on him than TTR so I let his comments be their own punishments. TTR hasn’t complained to me about it by the way

Really? I thought it was just banter. Had a couple of colleagues once who regularly took themselves off to Thailand. As you might expect, going to a place with such a huge se x industry, there was no end of staff room innuendo...but it was all just harmless banter.

Anyway...nowt to do with me. As regards your other ‘half sensible’ post...it hardly seems worth mentioning any more as all that happens is you get accused of ‘crying’, ‘screaming’ or ‘not accepting’ things by those who are all too willing to take offence over other issues as and when it suits them.

Interestingly Tricky’s new hero, Christopher Biggins, in his love in (sorry interview) with Farage refers to friends who’s businesses have seriously struggled as a result of Brexit...but then he covers himself by laughingly saying he’s not sure whether to believe them. So that’s alright then.

[Andy_Faber]

Really? I thought it was just banter. Had a couple of colleagues once who regularly took themselves off to Thailand. As you might expect, going to a place with such a huge se x industry, there was no end of staff room innuendo...but it was all just harmless banter.

Anyway...nowt to do with me. As regards your other ‘half sensible’ post...it hardly seems worth mentioning any more as all that happens is you get accused of ‘crying’, ‘screaming’ or ‘not accepting’ things by those who are all too willing to take offence over other issues as and when it suits them.

Interestingly Tricky’s new hero, Christopher Biggins, in his love in (sorry interview) with Farage refers to friends who’s businesses have seriously struggled as a result of Brexit...but then he covers himself by laughingly saying he’s not sure whether to believe them. So that’s alright then.

Once or twice is banter, IMO he’s been a bit to persistent with it.

You won’t get crying/screaming off me, not accepting maybe. But then you didn’t accept my positives. After a fraught exchange I think we did arrive at the HGV driver thing being an unknown level of contribution from Brexit but not sure what else you’ve offered as a negative that the man in the street can ACTUALLY see

[ramAnag]

Once or twice is banter, IMO he’s been a bit to persistent with it.

You won’t get crying/screaming off me, not accepting maybe. But then you didn’t accept my positives. After a fraught exchange I think we did arrive at the HGV driver thing being an unknown level of contribution from EU but not sure what else.

I wouldn’t know...haven’t noticed. There is a fine line between banter and personal abuse...but Swale certainly isn’t the only one to tread it imo.

As regards your request for Brexit examples. They fall into at least two categories...one more tangible than the other.

For committed Brexiteers, of which there appear to be one and two halves on here, it is a good thing that we have separated ourselves from mainland Europe...an opportunity for more flag waving, general jingoism, better off without ‘Jonny Foreigner’ attitudes etc.
For Remainers that is a negative. We are in favour of playing our part within a united Europe. That isn’t to say that everything about the EU was perfect...far from it, there needed to be changes...but, philosophically, it is better to be part of something which, in both a geographical and a trading sense, is such a natural fit.
Probably a 50/50 ‘philosophical’ split there.

More practical examples relating to the above relate to matters relating to crime, terrorism, defence and the like where, imo...and I think Remainers in general, we are stronger and more organised as part of the EU and a less fragmented Europe.

Beyond that...Covid has made certain comparisons difficult and I make no claim to any expertise where the complexities of trade are concerned.
It does however make no sense, imo, to distance ourselves from the huge trading organisation that the EU represents.
It makes no sense to alienate European workers who were playing a crucial part in the UK economy doing jobs that UK workers suddenly seen reluctant to take on.
We have seen the impact of this so far where HGV drivers are concerned (yes I accept there are other factors), where fruit and veg pickers are concerned and in the hotel and catering industry. Whether, or to what extent, this translates to the NHS remains to be seen. At the moment, like many things including freedom of movement, the impact on the NHS is clouded by Covid but, anecdotally...some years ago I had to have a relatively minor hand operation. From memory the team of five included three different European nationalities including a lead Spanish surgeon. I don’t know how many of that team remain or have possibly left having been made to feel unwelcome in the UK following the Referendum.

Northern Ireland isn’t looking too clever since Brexit is it and the Brexit campaign did lie about the possible outcomes for NI.

I’ll await the howls of outrage and derision from the two usual suspects but I hope I’ve provided some examples of disadvantages. Doubtless Swale can put more flesh on the bones in terms of actual financial details, but apart from Tricky’s anti USE stance and you suggesting that trade with China and Turkey may be easier I’ve seen no sensible benefits.

[Andy_Faber]

I wouldn’t know...haven’t noticed. There is a fine line between banter and personal abuse...but Swale certainly isn’t the only one to tread it imo.

As regards your request for Brexit examples. They fall into at least two categories...one more tangible than the other.

For committed Brexiteers, of which there appear to be one and two halves on here, it is a good thing that we have separated ourselves from mainland Europe...an opportunity for more flag waving, general jingoism, better off without ‘Jonny Foreigner’ attitudes etc.
For Remainers that is a negative. We are in favour of playing our part within a united Europe. That isn’t to say that everything about the EU was perfect...far from it, there needed to be changes...but, philosophically, it is better to be part of something which, in both a geographical and a trading sense, is such a natural fit.
Probably a 50/50 ‘philosophical’ split there.

More practical examples relating to the above relate to matters relating to crime, terrorism, defence and the like where, imo...and I think Remainers in general, we are stronger and more organised as part of the EU and a less fragmented Europe.

Beyond that...Covid has made certain comparisons difficult and I make no claim to any expertise where the complexities of trade are concerned.
It does however make no sense, imo, to distance ourselves from the huge trading organisation that the EU represents.
It makes no sense to alienate European workers who were playing a crucial part in the UK economy doing jobs that UK workers suddenly seen reluctant to take on.
We have seen the impact of this so far where HGV drivers are concerned (yes I accept there are other factors), where fruit and veg pickers are concerned and in the hotel and catering industry. Whether, or to what extent, this translates to the NHS remains to be seen. At the moment, like many things including freedom of movement, the impact on the NHS is clouded by Covid but, anecdotally...some years ago I had to have a relatively minor hand operation. From memory the team of five included three different European nationalities including a lead Spanish surgeon. I don’t know how many of that team remain or have possibly left having been made to feel unwelcome in the UK following the Referendum.

Northern Ireland isn’t looking too clever since Brexit is it and the Brexit campaign did lie about the possible outcomes for NI.

I’ll await the howls of outrage and derision from the two usual suspects but I hope I’ve provided some examples of disadvantages. Doubtless Swale can put more flesh on the bones in terms of actual financial details, but apart from Tricky’s anti USE stance and you suggesting that trade with China and Turkey may be easier I’ve seen no sensible benefits.

No howls of outrage from me rA because there aren’t any ACTUAL examples here other than from the nebulous world of rumour and/or the media. I repeat a bit more clearly - where’s Brexit ACTUALLY impacted you or people you know?

NB I’m sitting in Corfu airport and BY FAR the biggest holdup (in what is a lovely airport compared to my last visit in 2016) is people with hold luggage and in fact that includes Covid holdups. There’s a second control gate for passports but that’s because we aren’t (and never have been) in the shengen area. I’ve just broken my rule of never engaging with folk in airports to correct someone on that

[ramAnag]

No howls of outrage from me rA because there aren’t any ACTUAL examples here other than from the nebulous world of rumour and/or the media. I repeat a bit more clearly - where’s Brexit ACTUALLY impacted you or people you know?

NB I’m sitting in Corfu airport and BY FAR the biggest holdup (in what is a lovely airport compared to my last visit in 2016) is people with hold luggage and in fact that includes Covid holdups. There’s a second control gate for passports but that’s because we aren’t (and never have been) in the shengen area. I’ve just broken my rule of never engaging with folk in airports to correct someone on that

You weren’t one of the two ‘usual suspects’.

I’m puzzled by the fact that you don’t think I’m ‘impacted’ upon by the shortages presented by the lack of lorry drivers, fruit and veg pickers and hospitality workers.
I’m further puzzled by the fact that you don’t think I’ll be impacted upon by the likely rise in NI based terrorism. I know that, unlike the above, it hasn’t happened yet but it does seem more likely than it has done since the late ‘90’s...because of the Brexit deal...and I’m puzzled by the fact that you don’t think the deterioration in our relationship with our neighbours and the subsequent decline in protection against organised crime and terrorism is something to be ignored.

Still...I’ve done my best...the cricket is on and interesting so, have a safe flight and at least you’re coming back to a couple of days of good European weather.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Go on then, I will bite! What shortages have you seen in your weekly sainsbury (other food sources are available) visit that are down to supply chain problems. I genuinely havent seen any down south? Your other 2 points can neither be demonstrated, nor denied, so lets just focus on these shortages you reference. A strawberry shortfall maybe, or a shortgae of imported french truffles ?

[ramAnag]

Go on then, I will bite! What shortages have you seen in your weekly sainsbury (other food sources are available) visit that are down to supply chain problems. I genuinely havent seen any down south? Your other 2 points can neither be demonstrated, nor denied, so lets just focus on these shortages you reference. A strawberry shortfall maybe, or a shortgae of imported french truffles ?

I don’t care whether you ‘bite’ or not such is your level of sarcasm these days.
We don’t ‘shop’ at the moment...we have things delivered...so I can’t remember the last time I visited a supermarket...but in recent weeks there appear to have been difficulties sourcing certain soft fruits (strawberries, raspberries and blueberries), certain breads and fresh green beans.
That’s my experience...along with the unemptied bins which Serco/DDDC continue to attribute LARGELY to Brexit.
Make of it what you will, I really couldn’t care less, but the question was about how people have been ‘impacted’ and I’ve answered honestly.
I’m far from poor and imagine that higher food prices will have had an immeasurably greater impact on those who are, but that’s not first hand experience and, given your belief in the ‘survival of the fittest’ mentality, you probably don’t care anyway.

P.S. If you detect a hint of annoyance don’t take it too personally...it’s more to do with England’s all too typical latest collapse than you.

[Geoff Parkstone]

That's interesting to see shortages manifesting themselves in online shopping - I don't do it myself having gone back to supermarkets these last 3 months after being vaccinated. Have not seen any of your shortages in either Sainsbury, Waitrose or Lidl ut such is the value of exchanges of experience. I have been genuinely surprised NOT to have experienced any post Brexit impact myself - but this maybe is consistent with my belief that it will take a long time to either see measurable benefits, or substantive negatives, affecting the man in the street

[Trickytreesreds]

You weren’t one of the two ‘usual suspects’.


I’m further puzzled by the fact that you don’t think I’ll be impacted upon by the likely rise in NI based terrorism. I know that, unlike the above, it hasn’t happened yet but it does seem more likely than it has done since the late ‘90’s...because of the Brexit deal...and I’m puzzled by the fact that you don’t think the deterioration in our relationship with our neighbours and the subsequent decline in protection against organised crime and terrorism is something to be ignored.

RA , I am a bit puzzled as well, with what puzzles you.
1. Lorries, well we've covered that. You brought up examples blaming Brexit, I'm like a lot of folks rebuffing that. There's a lot of people using that as an excuse, as it suits an agenda. SO...

2. NI............. The UK fundamentally, wants to change naff all in Ireland. The only ones pushing a disruption agenda and agitating the peace agreement, is the EU. It is perfectly solvable, but the EU has its own reasons like control/being under mined/pandoras box/ even revenge to make it awkward.

3. Relationships with our neighbours? We have been in Europe since 6000BC. We haven't left even now,
Why or how, should being an EU club member effect that?
The issue at hand here, as the morphing from an economic alliance, to an ever expanding political one
There is absolutely nothing to stop any nation co operating with another on crime/terror etc. The bollox of it is, because the EU is pissed off.
Forget the policing, it was the armed services they really wanted co operation on, even though we was already in one through NATO.

All I see is agumentative agreement, for a system of unelected bureaucrats, that is taking a great delight in causing as much disruption as possible.
Put it back to an Economic alliance again and I'll relent.
Personally, the bullying attempts just harden my resolve and I'd sooner burn in hell, than give in to it.

[Trickytreesreds]

That's interesting to see shortages manifesting themselves in online shopping - I don't do it myself having gone back to supermarkets these last 3 months after being vaccinated. Have not seen any of your shortages in either Sainsbury, Waitrose or Lidl ut such is the value of exchanges of experience. I have been genuinely surprised NOT to have experienced any post Brexit impact myself - but this maybe is consistent with my belief that it will take a long time to either see measurable benefits, or substantive negatives, affecting the man in the street

I concur. I have only seen the odd item missing in my supermarket. Next visit, it's there. Was it a life decisive moment? No, I'm afraid it wasn't.
All it has been, is a hiccup to something new. The day I see a supermarket bare, like the COVID squirrels, then I'll panic.

[Trickytreesreds]

RA, have you ever seen this. It's how low they are prepared to go and don't give a toss about peace in Ireland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0eqqxJE7aA