OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[ramAnag]

Just a quickie as this isn't really thread specific, but why are you so against social injustice in any nook and cranny? By my estimate you are probably in the above average "privileged" class, so why the passion for "justice". Where does it stem from?

This is a serious question. I imagine we shared the same political stances when at university (from what you've said) but most of my contemporaries have, like me, long since abandoned the cause as we survive, grow and "better ourselves". But for you the passion still burns?

Much more intriguing would be...what changed you?
Were we similar throughout University...I wouldn’t know. Politically speaking I was left wing but never extremely so. It was more about having a good time and making it last as long as possible which, in my case, went on for a fantastic five years.
Maybe it’s to do with me having done English and History and you being all about numbers...or maybe it’s the different circles we’ve worked in since.
I made a point of working with the disadvantaged in deprived areas. It’s what I wanted to do. You’ve worked with the wealthy and - probably in a number of cases - helping those who want to avoid putting more than they need to into the system. I’ve also always had a healthy hatred of bullies and bullying, and to me racism, ***ism etc are just extensions, sometimes state sanctioned, of bullying.
Ultimately I’d like to see a fairer and better society for my old age, my children and my grandchildren. I’ve certainly bettered myself and I believe in people being able to do that. I just don’t want to see others downtrodden in the process. Nothing very unusual in that stance amongst my circle of friends.

[Trickytreesreds]

[QUOTE=ramAnag;39869271]

Pointless continuing Tricky. I know virtually nothing about Chubby Brown and you simply want to turn him into some sort of ‘free speech martyr’.
I have no idea whether he’s being ‘victimised by a moralistic few’ or not...but he isn’t the first and he won’t be the last to be banned.
CB apart, I don’t know where you’re going with this. Your argument seems to be...if people choose and can afford to buy a ticket then they can watch whatever they like. I think maybe not on that one.

Listen, my point is, Chubby Brown is an adult commedian. His act has never changed in 30 years. He has also, has a number 3 record,been on tv in many shows. But his stage show is advertised as strictly adult only. Lots of swearing and crude jokes.
My point is- who gets to decide, WHAT YOU AND I, CAN/CAN NOT WATCH?
No one forces you to go. If you don't pay for his show, you cannot attend to be offended.
Making any offence you may have, after being warned, irrelevent.
The fact you don't understand this, concerns me.

Let me put it another way. I wouldn't attend a rap concert or drill music concert if you paid me.
Not only do I find it mundane crap, it is also full of references of gun violence and degredation of women.
But it is my choice, NOT to listen to it or attend.
So by the definition of the action you are defending, why aren't the said concerts banned?

[ramAnag]

[QUOTE=Trickytreesreds;39869552]

Listen, my point is, Chubby Brown is an adult commedian. His act has never changed in 30 years. He has also, has a number 3 record,been on tv in many shows. But his stage show is advertised as strictly adult only. Lots of swearing and crude jokes.
My point is- who gets to decide, WHAT YOU AND I, CAN/CAN NOT WATCH?
No one forces you to go. If you don't pay for his show, you cannot attend to be offended.
Making any offence you may have, after being warned, irrelevent.
The fact you don't understand this, concerns me.

Let me put it another way. I wouldn't attend a rap concert or drill music concert if you paid me.
Not only do I find it mundane crap, it is also full of references of gun violence and degredation of women.
But it is my choice, NOT to listen to it or attend.
So by the definition of the action you are defending, why aren't the said concerts banned?

I know what your point is and I’m unsurprised that you’re a Chubby Brown fan...but you’ve still to answer my question...if people have access to and can afford a ticket does that mean they can watch what they like?
Sure we’ve been here before with that idiot Bernard Manning...and yes I would have had him banned...for being an offensive tw@t. You probably admired him too.

[Trickytreesreds]

[QUOTE=ramAnag;39869662]

I know what your point is and I’m unsurprised that you’re a Chubby Brown fan...but you’ve still to answer my question...if people have access to and can afford a ticket does that mean they can watch what they like?
Sure we’ve been here before with that idiot Bernard Manning...and yes I would have had him banned...for being an offensive tw@t. You probably admired him too.

Wow a lot of assumptions there. I saw Chubby Brown when I was 22. Full works outing.
I thought he was funny, but I haven't seen him since. Never seen Bernard Manning in my life.

So yes, if you buy a ticket for a private, why should you not be allowed to do so?
I gave you an example, on rap/drill music(assuming you know what that is). Hate the pap, but if it folks want it, fine. Just keep it away from my ears.

How far do you want to go?
Choudary was spouting racist bile, in public for years and no one had the guts to take him down. Yet the council can ban a comedian?
The internet, is probably/surely full of stuff you or I don't approve of. From terrorist videos to sheep shagging lol.
But it goes on.

So what you are suggesting, is a fascist sate then? Or a communist one?
The party/state decides what is good for you? Because believe me, that's how you sound.

[ramAnag]

Probably only how I sound to you and as I said before there’s little point in continuing.
I actually couldn’t care less about Chubby Brown...you like him and are angry at him being banned...but ultimately there always has been censorship of one sort or another.
I’m not sure why you’ve brought Choudary up...as you know I despise all fundamentalists, he’s a far cry from Chubby Brown and, as far as I know, has never appeared on stage in Sheffield.
You can bang on as much as you like about fascist and communist states, but I’ve already shown you how censorship exists and the fact that you don’t recognise the dangers of people being able to watch what they like in private so long as they can afford it makes me think you haven’t really thought this through. As for CB...for about the fourth time...I don’t know or care enough to judge.

[MadAmster]

rA I think TTR's point is that the content of CB's "comedy" is not illegal and therefore shouldn't be banned by the "politically correct" mob.

With regard to rap/drill rap, might some of the lyrics be promoting violence? In that case they possibly DO break the Law and a ban may well be appropriate.

As they say.... Just sayin'

[ramAnag]

rA I think TTR's point is that the content of CB's "comedy" is not illegal and therefore shouldn't be banned by the "politically correct" mob.

As they say.... Just sayin'

I know what his point is, MA, although I don’t really know why the Brexit thread has been hijacked by Chubby Brown.
My points are that the banning of certain performers is, rightly or wrongly, hardly unprecedented and that, for those looking for a martyr to the cause of ‘free speech’, a potty mouthed ‘blue’ comedian is probably the wrong ‘offering’.
Personally I don’t really care...his mentor Bernard Manning I did think was out of order because he was racist and divisive...I don’t know enough about CB’s content to comment, but Sheffield City Hall isn’t the only place to ban him and for all those desperate to see him, there will probably be an equal number happy to hear that his performance isn’t going ahead in their town or city.
As you say...’just sayin’.

[Andy_Faber]

I know what his point is, MA, although I don’t really know why the Brexit thread has been hijacked by Chubby Brown.

I'd say its because its relevant, and going back to my long-held belief, many of those who voted Brexit did so as much by way of protest as anything, a protest against constantly being told what was good for them

PS if you want an example of wokeness, check out Sir Ed Davey's stomach-turning failure to defend women in his interview with Andrew Marr earlier.

[ramAnag]

I'd say its because its relevant, and going back to my long-held belief, many of those who voted Brexit did so as much by way of protest as anything, a protest against constantly being told what was good for them

PS if you want an example of wokeness, check out Sir Ed Davey's stomach-turning failure to defend women in his interview with Andrew Marr earlier.

Hmmm...thought you always denied that Brexit was nothing more than a ‘protest vote’.
We’re always being told what is good for us, Andy...how fast we can drive, how much we can drink, how many calories to take in, never to smoke, how much time to spend in the sun, what type of petrol to use, how old we must be to engage in a variety of activities etc... and never more so than during the last twenty months or so, when one of the things you and I have agreed on is the stupidity of those who have ignored being told what to do via government/ scientific advice surrounding Covid.

I’ve no idea what Ed Daley said...never take much notice of him anyway...but I suspect Mr. Vasey has nothing to do with Brexit other than being another excuse for Tricky to have another stupid ‘snowflake’ rant.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Who is Ed Daley? I cannot even google a good answer as the only one I find have been dead for years?

As for Royston, I've never seen him, but is he any worse than Jimmy Carr or Frankie Boyle in his politically incorrect approach to making people laugh. I suppose he is - Royston has never been seen on TV, the other two are regulars, Royston spent his early years in borstal and jail, the other two at university....... Ah such is the equality of opportunity we all crave

I remember being mighty pissed off when at university myself when Birmingham City Council banned The Tubes from performing and my tickets had to go back (replaced by seeing Captain Beefheart as it happens). It was extremely annoying and I've always objected to such nanny state censorship ever since.

Its not the same thing as maximum driving speeds etc examples that you cite rA - the examples you cite do not mean that you cannot do them- its just that there could be consequences if you do. You cannot attend a comedian's performance or a gig if some council official bans it. it simply wont happen. Same with censoring Lolita, Lady Chatterley's Lover, Spycatcher to name but a few examples closer to your territory.

[Trickytreesreds]

Hmmm...thought you always denied that Brexit was nothing more than a ‘protest vote’.
We’re always being told what is good for us, Andy...how fast we can drive, how much we can drink, how many calories to take in, never to smoke, how much time to spend in the sun, what type of petrol to use, how old we must be to engage in a variety of activities etc... and never more so than during the last twenty months or so, when one of the things you and I have agreed on is the stupidity of those who have ignored being told what to do via government/ scientific advice surrounding Covid.

I’ve no idea what Ed Daley said...never take much notice of him anyway...but I suspect Mr. Vasey has nothing to do with Brexit other than being another excuse for Tricky to have another stupid ‘snowflake’ rant.

Jesus wept can you hear youself?
Fast driving- Legal limits, so break them at your peril
Drink, not illegal, only advisory and there is no prohibition
Calories? eat what you like, not illegal but it will harm you, so advisory
Smoking, not illegal, may kill you so your choice
Have they banned you from any of those things? NO THEY BLOODY WELL HAVEN'T

So call this a snowflake rant if you want, because that is exactly what it is.
Snowflakes like you, defending people who decide what I/or anyone else can/cannot do.
That's the whole point of Chubby Brown. You've said yourself you don't care and don't like him. So would it give YOU the right to stop him performing?

You are the epitomy of exactly why I rant.
QED

[Andy_Faber]

I remember being mighty pissed off when at university myself when Birmingham City Council banned The Tubes from performing and my tickets had to go back (replaced by seeing Captain Beefheart as it happens). It was extremely annoying and I've always objected to such nanny state censorship ever since.

Probably the same tour when I saw the Tubes briefly at De Montford Hall and Fee Waybill fell off stage onto some fellahs from Uttoxeter thus breaking his leg. A great band, all 50 of them (or so it seemed, never seen so many people on the stage)

[Geoff Parkstone]

1977 White Punks on Dope tour

[Andy_Faber]

Hmmm...thought you always denied that Brexit was nothing more than a ‘protest vote’.
We’re always being told what is good for us, Andy...how fast we can drive, how much we can drink, how many calories to take in, never to smoke, how much time to spend in the sun, what type of petrol to use, how old we must be to engage in a variety of activities etc... and never more so than during the last twenty months or so, when one of the things you and I have agreed on is the stupidity of those who have ignored being told what to do via government/ scientific advice surrounding Covid.

I’ve no idea what Ed Daley said...never take much notice of him anyway...but I suspect Mr. Vasey has nothing to do with Brexit other than being another excuse for Tricky to have another stupid ‘snowflake’ rant.

I agree with GP that the examples you give aren't compaable, but my spin is that all the things you've listed have a demonstrable and unarguable (apart from by nutters) beneficial impact on health, the presence of Roy Chubby Brown in a private setting with optional attendance does not.

DAVEY not Daley. I thought you voted Lib Dem?

[Andy_Faber]

1977 White Punks on Dope tour

No, it was the 1978 tour. Widely reported as happening in London, Fee fell off stage in Leicester, there is (or was, I cant find it atm) even a vid of it happening as The Tubes were subject of a US documentary at the time