O/T:- ⚠️Impressed with the leadership [The UK Party Politics Thread]

[i961pie]

No surprise there from the man who thinks the gas chambers were a useful tidying up exercise.

?????

[maddogslater]

Quote Frenchie
Let not any one pacify his conscience by the delusion that he can do no harm if he takes no part, and forms no opinion. Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing. He is not a good man who, without a protest, allows wrong to be committed in his name, and with the means which he helps to supply, because he will not trouble himself to use his mind on the subject.

... How right to quote this passage ... but where does this leave us/NATO all ... in utter shame and guilt that we haven't taken offensive action with the Ukranians.
This mode of using war's to make money is sickening (as typified by the US from WW1 onwards). ...[/QUOTE]
So you think it's right to risk nuclear war with Russia, possibly a world war over a country not part of nato, that only a few years ago was being called out by the new York Times and guardian as being corrupt and ultra neo fascist.

[TheBlackHorse]

... yep ... you can't negotiate with bullies.

[drillerpie]

So you think it's right to risk nuclear war with Russia, possibly a world war over a country not part of nato, that only a few years ago was being called out by the new York Times and guardian as being corrupt and ultra neo fascist.

Being called a fascist by the New York Times/Guardian is hardly unusual!

Joking aside, I read the article you posted last night. It's quite interesting, although if you were reading it critically you could question a lot of the assertions he makes.

When I finished the article, (including clicking the links you mention) my understanding of it was that he said Eastern Europe, including Russia, has a problem with anti Semitism - and linked to a BBC article from 2014 which said although the far right political party doesn't get that many votes it has some of its people in positions of power, like a police commissioner they mentioned in the south of Ukraine.

I didn't see the part where Ukraine was classed as an "ultra neo fascist country" but will be happy to read that if you can point it out.

Regarding corruption, you will unfortunately find that it is endemic across all the old communist countries (and not only there).

Interestingly, the writer of the article you linked to, and presumably agree with very enthusiastically, explicitly claims that the Guardian is the pet newspaper of the British security services, so I'm a little bit surprised you trust it enough to rely on it as a source.

[maddogslater]

I don't necessarily agree with the hole article but find a different narrative interesting from the usual perspective and current narrative put out by the mainstream media, thanks for your opinion which I always find informative.

[JoePass]

Never voted Labour in my life. Once voted Tory when they had a human standing. Recently I'll vote for any progressive candidate with a social concience who can defeat corrupt, racist, authoritarian fascists. You have the right to support the latter, we live in democracies. Doesn't mean I don't despise you.

Yawnnnnn Typical of a man who knows nothing the world, you may grow up one day, however, adopting the French way of life means you will have to buy a few white flags to wave.

[i961pie]

The last bit made me laugh Soccerman which for you is quite surprising😜

[Elite_Pie]

Tory Party chairman Oliver Dowden on Sunday admitted the local elections would be “challenging” but warned MPs that ousting Mr Johnson now would harm the national interest. Mr Dowden told Ridge on Sunday on Sky News: “I think the uncertainty that would be caused by a change of leader would be dearly damaging to this country.”

Nice one Oliver. So the possible uncertainty caused by a change of leader would be more damaging than the complete certainty that we have a serial liar with no morals as our leader?

How does that work?

[SaltySeaDog]

Tory Party chairman Oliver Dowden on Sunday admitted the local elections would be “challenging” but warned MPs that ousting Mr Johnson now would harm the national interest. Mr Dowden told Ridge on Sunday on Sky News: “I think the uncertainty that would be caused by a change of leader would be dearly damaging to this country.”

Nice one Oliver. So the possible uncertainty caused by a change of leader would be more damaging than the complete certainty that we have a serial liar with no morals as our leader?

How does that work?

haha. You've got to laugh at how absurd this has become

I always knew Boris was a clown, but now he's turned the leadership of our country into a big joke. Unfortunately it doesn't really surprise me though

[Magpies1959]

Salty Sea Dog, do you know Boris personally then.
Worryingly for me, I think the media rule the world more than the party in power of each country. They managed to just Trump, as has been admitted by the American media, and now our msm are trying their utmost to do the same to Johnson.
On the face of it, it does look a naive/arrogant thing to host a 'party', except it wasn't a party, and it was outdoors and their was social distancing. The worrying bit comes in when Starmer has food and drink inside and nothing is done about it. Oh yes turns out he is mates with the Durham police commissioner, how convenient.
I wouldn't mind the flak Johnson gets about lying, if Labour supporters accepted that Starmer tells porkies too, as do all politicians.

[Elite_Pie]

So the Sue Gray report has thrown up three options:

1. Boris Johnson is lying through his teeth.
2. Boris Johnson hasn't got a clue what's happening around him.
3. Boris Johnson is happy for the country to be governed under the influence of alcohol.

All three options show that Boris Johnson should resign.

Anyone with more than one brain cell knows it's option one, but incredibly a lot don't seem bothered.

[Elite_Pie]

So only 59% of Tory MPs have confidence in Boris Johnson as our leader. When you consider that a fair number of the 59% who voted for him will have put their career prospects above their morals, that's pretty damning. How many of the electorate have confidence in him? He will never resign, so hopefully a few more of the Tory sycophants will perform a U-turn in the coming weeks. This country deserves so much better.

[magpie_mania]

So only 59% of Tory MPs have confidence in Boris Johnson as our leader. When you consider that a fair number of the 59% who voted for him will have put their career prospects above their morals, that's pretty damning. How many of the electorate have confidence in him? He will never resign, so hopefully a few more of the Tory sycophants will perform a U-turn in the coming weeks. This country deserves so much better.

'Now we can get on with the job, that's what the public want us to do'

Yes it is ........ Just a huge number that don't want you to be in charge Boris!

Can't see how this has improved things ..... just made them a whole lot worse I think.

[i961pie]

He is a lame duck leader now and it is only a matter of time before he goes.
I would have thought though from a Labour point of view having Boris in charge at the next election would surely win them power. 41% of his own party don't want him never mind the electorate.
Getting a new leader might unite the party and they then would have a couple of years to convince the country to vote them in again.

[OP67]

He is a lame duck leader now and it is only a matter of time before he goes.
I would have thought though from a Labour point of view having Boris in charge at the next election would surely win them power. 41% of his own party don't want him never mind the electorate.
Getting a new leader might unite the party and they then would have a couple of years to convince the country to vote them in again.

That would have to be the biggest swing in history for Labour to overturn the majority the Tories have. I can see the Lib Dems taking a number of both Labour and Tory votes if they both enter the next election which their current leaders. Labour still has a massive chunk of Corbyn lovers who will not back Starmer. That would lead to another Tory government though.