OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[swaledale]

Not sure it’s a growing number I think everyone here has been pretty consistent, the extremists at either end (yourself, Swale, TTR) seeing nothing good/bad in The Management’s management, the rest mooching around somewhere in between each with their pet ‘beef’ and/or area of expertise. I sometimes refer right back to the early days of the Brexit thread and little has changed

Well people who voted for Johnsons party are in the main happy to ignore his failings, even his lack of leadership, I read an interesting article the other day which said that the Democrats would be unwise to make Trumps incompetence an electoral issue as his supporters don't give a toss, they just think he is something different and ignore what doesn't suit them.

The exact same can be said of those who support this Government, or at the very least give them the benefit of the doubt, the either don't care about competence or actually would notrecognise competence if it smacked them in the face.

My post on quotes from Brexiteers is a case in point, its a matter of record what was said, its a matter of fact what has actually happened, will that change the ardent Brexiteers view? Doubt it and now any apocalypse will be handily blamed on Covid-19!

[swaledale]

I'm still in the EU. I'm still against the EU and for all the same reasons as before.

Now, I can add their lack of joined up thinking with regard to CV-19. This whole pandemic lark was a perfect opportunity to to have a grand central plan with the odd local difference where diverting from the central plan makes local sense.

They failed.

Well I think its too early to say whether they failed and I'd like to see your analysis of that statement.


Nobody least of all me has claimed that the EU is perfect, but then neither is democracy or any organisation thats run by human beings. Economically we have benefited immensely from access to the single market, theres an argument politically for withdrawing from it, but to go for a "hard" Brexit makes absolutely no sense.

[AdiSalisbury]

I don't remember being critical? Other than the odd bit of sarcasm I've kept out of this for a long time.

[Trickytreesreds]

Swale and I...extremists? Really?
I think you need to check your definitions, Andy. You also need to read R59’s Covid thread through.

It is probably true to say that, in no particular order, Swale, mista and I...closely followed by MA...are the most conspicuously left of centre but ‘extremists’? I don’t think so.

As for ‘growing numbers’. Adi, R59 himself and even you have, in recent days, all - at times - been critical of the Government’s performance while Tricky has, thankfully, had little to say about anything since he babbled on about Thailand’s road carnage and GP has done nothing except snipe from the sidelines...no longer apparently able to take a stance.

In truth we have a Government stumbling from crisis to crisis. I totally accept that the Pandemic is unprecedented in living memory but the worst figures in Europe and the prospect of the deepest subsequent recession tells its own story. Add to that the chaos over exam results, the uncertainty over safe returns to schools and the fact that Brexit is now fractionally over four months away while senior ministers all seem to be conspicuous only by their absence and you hardly have to be an ‘extremist’ to recognise that there’s a problem.

WTF do you mean nothing to say? You mean nothing to say that doesn't suit your rantings of blaming Johnson for everything? I spilt a tin of paint today. It was obviously Johnsons fault for not organising a mandatory anti tip tin.
My "Ramblings" about Thailands road carnage were on about how governments react to somethings but not others. You on the other hand are stuck in the land of "doomsday" over the kung flu, when the reality is, more people die from every day events that no one gives a toss about.
You're retired, no money worries, no impact on your life. Try looking out your sand pit once in a while and think that others need to get on with it, or go under.
Dead easy to sit in a ivory tower and moan and criticise, when you're not the one struggling.
People are dying because of kung flu, not through it.
I despair at times, I really do.

[mistaram]

Oh God RA look what you have done now Ivory tower in the Dales sounds idyllic .

[Trickytreesreds]

A brilliant post from an ER nurse in the US...

"Anyone out there who can tell me what our end game is with the covid 19?

What is the magic formula that is going to allow us to sound the all clear?

Is it zero cases?

The only way that will happen is if we just stop testing and stop reporting.

Is it a vaccine?

It took 25 years for a chicken pox vaccine to be developed.

The smallpox inoculation was discovered in 1796 the last known natural case was in 1977.

We have a flu vaccine that is only 40 to 60% effective and less than half of the US population choose to get one, and roughly 20,000 Americans will die of the flu or flu complications.

Oh, you'll mandate it, like other vaccines are mandated in order to attend school, travel to some foreign countries, etc.

We already have a growing number of anti vaxxers refusing proven, tested, well known vaccines that have been administered for decades but aren’t necessarily safe!

Do you really think people will flock to get a fast tracked, quickly tested vaccine, whose long term side effects and overall efficacy are anyone's best guess?

How long are we going to cancel and postpone and reconsider?

You aren't doing in person school until second quarter?

What if October's numbers are the same as August's?

You moved football to spring?

What if next March is worse than this one was?

When do we decide quality of life outweighs the risks?

I understand Covid can be deadly or very dangerous for SOME people, but so are strawberries and so is shellfish.

We take risks multiple times a day without a second thought.

We know driving a car can be dangerous, we don't leave it in the garage.

We know the dangers of smoking, drinking and eating fried foods, we do it anyway.

We speed, we don't buckle our seatbelts, we take more than directed.

Quite a few people don't think twice about unprotected ***, they just hop right to it.

Is hugging Grandma really more dangerous than rush hour on the freeway?

Is going out with friends after work more risky than 4 day old gas station sushi?

Or operating a chainsaw?

When and how did we so quickly lose our free will?

Is there a waiver somewhere I can sign that says, "I understand the risks, but I choose a life with Hugs and Smiles, and the State Fair and Concerts and Homecoming."

I understand that there is a minuscule possibility I could die, but I will most likely end up feeling like crap for a few days.

I understand I could possibly pass it to someone else, if I'm not careful, but I can pass any virus onto someone else.

I'm struggling to see where or how this ends.

We either get busy living or we get busy dying.

When God decides it's your time, you don't get any mulligans, so I guess I would rather spend my time enjoying it and living in the moment and not worrying about what ifs and maybes, and I bet I'm not the only one."

[ramAnag]

WTF do you mean nothing to say? You mean nothing to say that doesn't suit your rantings of blaming Johnson for everything? I spilt a tin of paint today. It was obviously Johnsons fault for not organising a mandatory anti tip tin.
My "Ramblings" about Thailands road carnage were on about how governments react to somethings but not others. You on the other hand are stuck in the land of "doomsday" over the kung flu, when the reality is, more people die from every day events that no one gives a toss about.
You're retired, no money worries, no impact on your life. Try looking out your sand pit once in a while and think that others need to get on with it, or go under.
Dead easy to sit in a ivory tower and moan and criticise, when you're not the one struggling.
People are dying because of kung flu, not through it.
I despair at times, I really do.

I mean exactly what I’ve said...AF identified you as an extremist - presumably of a very different type to Swale and I - and I was simply pointing out that you’ve been very quiet recently apart from banging on about Thailand’s road accident problem which was scarcely relevant to the topic.

I’m not complaining that you’ve been quiet...much prefer it that way tbh.

I’d love to know how I’m sitting in an ‘ivory tower’ in the land of ‘doomsday’ with ‘no money worries’ because I’ve retired...I really would. Maybe you’re guilty of one or two assumptions there TTR...but of course it suits your argument to present me - and my family - as having some sort of ‘get out of Covid free’ card. It is also complete bollux.

As for Johnson...I don’t and have never blamed him for everything...he is however - for the ump****th time - a man whose record in terms of personal responsibility and morality, as a politician and as a PM doesn’t really stand up to close scrutiny.

If you disagree with that last sentiment perhaps you and GP could offer an alternative view instead of just moaning about mine.

[ramAnag]

I don't remember being critical? Other than the odd bit of sarcasm I've kept out of this for a long time.

Apologies Adi...I was sure you’d written something vaguely critical recently but I can’t find it and must have been mistaken.

[MadAmster]

TTR, really? Bringing an invisible man in the sky into it? I won't go deeply into the religion thing as it's not the subject of this thread. Suffice it to say it's all a load of bolleaux designed to keep control of the masses.

[mistaram]

A brilliant post from an ER nurse in the US...

"Anyone out there who can tell me what our end game is with the covid 19?

What is the magic formula that is going to allow us to sound the all clear?

Is it zero cases?

The only way that will happen is if we just stop testing and stop reporting.

Is it a vaccine?

It took 25 years for a chicken pox vaccine to be developed.

The smallpox inoculation was discovered in 1796 the last known natural case was in 1977.

We have a flu vaccine that is only 40 to 60% effective and less than half of the US population choose to get one, and roughly 20,000 Americans will die of the flu or flu complications.

Oh, you'll mandate it, like other vaccines are mandated in order to attend school, travel to some foreign countries, etc.

We already have a growing number of anti vaxxers refusing proven, tested, well known vaccines that have been administered for decades but aren’t necessarily safe!

Do you really think people will flock to get a fast tracked, quickly tested vaccine, whose long term side effects and overall efficacy are anyone's best guess?

How long are we going to cancel and postpone and reconsider?

You aren't doing in person school until second quarter?

What if October's numbers are the same as August's?

You moved football to spring?

What if next March is worse than this one was?

When do we decide quality of life outweighs the risks?

I understand Covid can be deadly or very dangerous for SOME people, but so are strawberries and so is shellfish.

We take risks multiple times a day without a second thought.

We know driving a car can be dangerous, we don't leave it in the garage.

We know the dangers of smoking, drinking and eating fried foods, we do it anyway.

We speed, we don't buckle our seatbelts, we take more than directed.

Quite a few people don't think twice about unprotected ***, they just hop right to it.

Is hugging Grandma really more dangerous than rush hour on the freeway?

Is going out with friends after work more risky than 4 day old gas station sushi?

Or operating a chainsaw?

When and how did we so quickly lose our free will?

Is there a waiver somewhere I can sign that says, "I understand the risks, but I choose a life with Hugs and Smiles, and the State Fair and Concerts and Homecoming."

I understand that there is a minuscule possibility I could die, but I will most likely end up feeling like crap for a few days.

I understand I could possibly pass it to someone else, if I'm not careful, but I can pass any virus onto someone else.

I'm struggling to see where or how this ends.

We either get busy living or we get busy dying.

When God decides it's your time, you don't get any mulligans, so I guess I would rather spend my time enjoying it and living in the moment and not worrying about what ifs and maybes, and I bet I'm not the only one."

If you believe all that ,which you obviously do than can you tell us why your wonderful intelligent government has already spent £190 billion fighting it . Causing us to have over £2 trillion debt . Surely there was need for the lockdown or furlough , Waste of time shutting schools ,,pubs , stopping concerts ,football etc Its all been a waste of time try telling that to bereaved families , airlines , retail businesses ,all those who have or about to be made redundant . Go ahead tell your government for wrong it wasn't that serious after all