Election Year or Fear!

[Geoff Parkstone]

I agree illegal immigration is a problem. It's not sustainable, it's a shame the likes of farage, Johnson and the 52% who voted brexit have put us in this position by reducing our ability to return those on the boats to where they came.

It's obvious it's what Farage thrives on. If Starmer and Labour make headway into solving the problem Farage has no case to argue, he becomes irrelevant.

Sadly your "if" suggests to me that Farage will continue to be relevant

I think Starmer has little inclination to solve it or he might have made some progress. Last month was highest numbers I think.

[Andy_Faber]

It's obvious it's what Farage thrives on. If Starmer and Labour make headway into solving the problem Farage has no case to argue, he becomes irrelevant.

There's two problems with that logic, which by the way I agree with. 1, He/they won't, 2. 'the problem' you refer to isn't actually the problem. Like GP I've been in the company of people with an entrenched view on this, they regard 'the boats' as merely increasing the bigger 'problem' and have successively voted Brexit/Conservative/Conservative/Labour in the hope it will be resolved, and will vote Reform next time if it is not

[SithHappens]

Sadly your "if" suggests to me that Farage will continue to be relevant

I think Starmer has little inclination to solve it or he might have made some progress. Last month was highest numbers I think.

I don't disagree, while, despite claims otherwise, I'm no starmer fan and have little confidence in him, I really hope he is successful. I'm not going to bash him just because.

But let's be serious this isn't an issue created by labour. It's a result of poor government over a longer period

[ramAnag]

There's two problems with that logic, which by the way I agree with. 1, He/they won't, 2. 'the problem' you refer to isn't actually the problem. Like GP I've been in the company of people with an entrenched view on this, they regard 'the boats' as merely increasing the bigger 'problem' and have successively voted Brexit/Conservative/Conservative/Labour in the hope it will be resolved, and will vote Reform next time if it is not

Out of interest, not antagonism, what are you suggesting ‘people with an entrenched view’ regard as the ‘bigger problem’?

[swaledale]

Sadly your "if" suggests to me that Farage will continue to be relevant

I think Starmer has little inclination to solve it or he might have made some progress. Last month was highest numbers I think.

OK 2 serious questions. 1. What makes you think Starmer has little inclination to solve it?

2. How do you think he would make progress and what makes you think he hasn't.

[swaledale]

Out of interest, not antagonism, what are you suggesting ‘people with an entrenched view’ regard as the ‘bigger problem’?

Ah now your asking a question which is multi faceted RA! if one breaks it down a little, then broadly speaking there are those who are for whatever reason, basically xenophobic, racist and to judge from recent research misogynistic and prone to abusing women and children, who see the problem as immigration end of.

There are those who feel let down, fed up with their circumstances in life, feel mistreated by governments over lack of services and look for a simple answer or scapegoat for their troubles and happen upon immigration as a handy reason. The so called "red wall" areas are a case in point, in many the proportion of the population that are not white British is 1% or less, yet still they claim lack of access to health, dentists, housing etc. etc. is down to immigration. Clacton being a prima facia example of this.

Then you have the "respectable middle class" generally over 50 age group who aren't necessarily racist or xenophobic in nature, but feel uncomfortable with the changes in society (often not actually directly affecting them), have a rose tinted view of what life was life back in those "good old" days and somehow ascribe immigration as one of the main reasons for this, rather than the inevitable evolution of change that happens and always has done, albeit such change seems to happen at a faster pace these days.

Add into the mix a 24hr news cycle with an over emphasis on the ethnicity of perpetrators of crimes, a constant drip feed of misinformation and falsehoods and really very little attempt to present a realistic balanced view of the issue and an agenda is being pushed for personal and political reasons.

As an example of the latter, a child abuse grooming gang in Rotherham was recently tried and sentenced, yet there were no headlines in the Daily fail, or GBeebies about it. Why? Because the members were all white British! It merited a footnote if it was reported at all.

[Andy_Faber]

As an example of the latter, a child abuse grooming gang in Rotherham was recently tried and sentenced, yet there were no headlines in the Daily fail, or GBeebies about it. Why? Because the members were all white British! It merited a footnote if it was reported at all.

I'm struggling to find evidence of that Swale, there are two isolated 'lone wolf' cases, but nothing coming up regarding a 'white British' gang. Provide a link if you would

[Andy_Faber]

Out of interest, not antagonism, what are you suggesting ‘people with an entrenched view’ regard as the ‘bigger problem’?

Before I respond, PLEASE NOTE this is an observation not an opinion, albeit its based on a pretty large sample and over nearly two decades, the bigger problem being 'the rise of Islam' with a side order of 'the apparent encouragement of/failure to stop it by 'the powers that be''

[ramAnag]

Before I respond, PLEASE NOTE this is an observation not an opinion, albeit its based on a pretty large sample and over nearly two decades, the bigger problem being 'the rise of Islam' with a side order of 'the apparent encouragement of/failure to stop it by 'the powers that be''

I appreciate it’s only an observation, but I really don’t understand it. As you know I have little time for any organised religion and I accept that there are more Muslims in the country with more high profile places of worship than there were 15, 20, 50 years ago but why do people find it a ‘problem’?

[Geoff Parkstone]

I agree illegal immigration is a problem. It's not sustainable, it's a shame the likes of farage, Johnson and the 52% who voted brexit have put us in this position by reducing our ability to return those on the boats to where they came.

I appreciate it’s only an observation, but I really don’t understand it. As you know I have little time for any organised religion and I accept that there are more Muslims in the country with more high profile places of worship than there were 15, 20, 50 years ago but why do people find it a ‘problem’?

It's not really religion, it's culture as much as anything. Just spend a little time in, say, London and see what it's like living in a third world country where white faces are in a minority, there are non Moslem no go areas, Moslem schools, Sharia law environment etc. This is our national capital.

Then go back to your predominantly white middle class ruralish middle England and contemplate the answer.

Then consider relative breeding rates and contemplate the future. This is why the white (predominantly) lower income / working classes are rapidly feeling sidelined in their own country.

Walk a mile in their shoes and consider. If you still retain your views, fine, you've tried to see it from a non privileged perspective - and you've got a new pair of shoes.

I've done it. And I thank **** I don't have to live in that environment