O/T And we wonder why we trust Starmer

[ragingpup]

Reposting made up reports doesn?t verify them it just increases the volume

What evidence do you have that the Ukraine independence referendum didn't happen?

[frogmiller]

What of her?

Who is she married to?

Obviously no one will influenced by their spouse.

[frogmiller]

Surrounded by nato? They are pretty much surrounded by their former ussr countries electing to join nato anyway, so if those countries, as independent nations, be allowed to do so, why can't Ukraine be allowed to do so? Since when has any independent nation been prevented from pursuing its own interest simply because its neighbour doesn't like it? No-one has really answered this. You want to have a go?

From my memory, the Minsk agreements were very poor documents that could be read in any way the reader chooses, and indeed it proved to be quite useless in resolving the conflict which incidentally was preceded by Russia's initial invasion in 2014. You want to have a go at telling me why Russia did this, as it came before the Minsk agreements?

You can?t join NATO if there is an on going conflict in your country.

Putin was clever?

[ragingpup]

You can?t join NATO if there is an on going conflict in your country.

Putin was clever?

Clever yes. Justified, no.

[Steve Miller]

If only we had a leader like Trump. What an inspiring speech tonight. Hope comrade Kier was watching and quivering.

The fact that you can't even spell S-man's name illuminates your stupidity like a lampstand. Go move to the Great Satan and worship your orange fat globule. Few will follow.

[Steve Miller]

I don't think anyone is happy about it and hopefully joined up European opposition allies can join with trump in pursuading Putin to withdraw from Ukraine, so it won't come to it. Seems to me if one nation invades another, we either join together using collective armed forces to meet the force with opposition, or we just look away and allow a nation to be taken by force in part at first but history tells us that such manouvres don't end there. We'll have to disagree, I think Europe should collectively stand up to Putin, and to be honest Russia's military capabilities are not strong, struggling even to hold onto what it has against the Ukranian forces. I understand the argument against it but I think the 1939 comparison holds as does the reason NATO was formed - if a democratic nation is invaded, collective force should be used to overcome it to avoid it escalating further.

I stand with you absolutely. The shower on here make it easy to see how WWII happened. Gutless, worthless self-service.
I was and am an absolute Brexiteer (based on migration policy primarily).
But I believe we MUST join a cohesive Europe on this.
I am absolutely not minded to accept two lunatic dictators deciding the future for all of us and this is the thin end of the thickest wedge (well, forgetting some on here).
Read Sholokov's Don novels if you want to understand the relationship of Ukraine and Russia. Wonderful stuff. Start with And Quiet Flows The Don.

[howdydoo]

I was and am an absolute Brexiteer (based on migration policy primarily).

You might want to listen to JD Vance's speech again and read the room.

Through their lens, maybe the US are warning Europe to put their house in order if we expect their continued support.

I find it amusing how we pour scorn on the US and think they're a bunch of idiots. It's just snobbery. Light years ahead of this country despite it's problems.

I'd suggest we see how this plays out before we pass judgement on anything.

Propaganda is firing in from all angles and all sides.

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

You might want to listen to JD Vance's speech again and read the room.

Through their lens, maybe the US are warning Europe to put their house in order if we expect their continued support.

I find it amusing how we pour scorn on the US and think they're a bunch of idiots. It's just snobbery. Light years ahead of this country despite it's problems.

I'd suggest we see how this plays out before we pass judgement on anything.

Propaganda is firing in from all angles and all sides.

Fear not, the BBC are doing a question time special to give more of a balanced view of the situation

[KerrAvon]

You might want to listen to JD Vance's speech again and read the room.

Through their lens, maybe the US are warning Europe to put their house in order if we expect their continued support.

I find it amusing how we pour scorn on the US and think they're a bunch of idiots. It's just snobbery. Light years ahead of this country despite it's problems.

I'd suggest we see how this plays out before we pass judgement on anything.

Propaganda is firing in from all angles and all sides.

I've watched Vance's speech and assumed that he was playing for laughs at times:

1. He banged on about the need for Europeans to respect the outcome of elections even if they don't like them. It's almost as though he's not a member of a party that launched numerous legal challenges to the 2020 US election results and is led by a man who still refuses to acknowledge the outcome.

2. He droned on about free speech. It's almost as though he isn't Vice President to a man who sets the MAGA mob on anyone who expresses critcism of him and spent the run up to the 2020 election getting that mob to chant 'lock her up' about his opponent.

[frogmiller]

I've watched Vance's speech and assumed that he was playing for laughs at times:

1. He banged on about the need for Europeans to respect the outcome of elections even if they don't like them. It's almost as though he's not a member of a party that launched numerous legal challenges to the 2020 US election results and is led by a man who still refuses to acknowledge the outcome.

2. He droned on about free speech. It's almost as though he isn't Vice President to a man who sets the MAGA mob on anyone who expresses critcism of him and spent the run up to the 2020 election getting that mob to chant 'lock her up' about his opponent.

Your opinion of him isn't good is it? You have a pre-conceived impression of what he was going to say regardless of what he said!

The MEGA mob as you call them is the majority of the American voters who voted for Donald Trump to be president and him to be Vice president.

A part of the justice system in the UK I would expect better or at least an open mind but like on many topics yours is closed and seem bias but no doubt you would take anyones money and argue regardless!