OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[ramAnag]

Here's a prediction Swale...I honestly think that Corbyn has 'killed' the Labour Party tonight. He could barely conceal his delight at being allowed to stand again and between him and Eagle they've just turned it into a laughing stock.

How can you stand as leader when virtually your entire shadow cabinet/senior parliamentary membership has resigned with a vote of no confidence?

Another prediction? There will be a new centre left party by the time of the next election...a coalition of Libs, Labour, Greens, SNP and the Welsh perhaps. May be no bad thing...don't know what it'll be called...'Nearly New Labour'? Maybe not...is there no end to the turmoil caused by that damned Referendum?

[southernram22]

i agree i usually vote labour but not with corbyn in charge.

[swaledale]

The labour party was killed by those smug *******s, like Blair who forgot about what the party stood for and focussed purely on becoming centre right party.

This latest turmoil is only the result of those who when first challenged by Corbynm could only focus on criticising him, not what they could offer as an alternative or recognising that they need to appeal to those who are forgotten or indeed ignored by most - people seem to despise Corbyn, yet he is essentially a decent honest principled politician, exactly what many seem to want, until that is one actually appears and they find that being principled and paying more attention to those left behind in society involves making some sacrifces like paying higher tax for instance.

Corbyns problem is essentially he is not a leader, he is too straightforward and does not have the charisma to enthuse people, I admire him for that but he should realise that life is about compromise and that being stubborn and unwavering does not necessarily achieve what you want to achieve.

A split would be no bad thing, there needs to be a creditable opposition party that does not try to to out Tory the tories, but has a credible alternative to appealing to peoples greed. A coaliton would be no nad thing, it has served Germany well and stops those swings from one extreme to the other, but then a move to a more democratic voting system where each persons vote counts has to be the first move, rather than the sytem we have now where in most areas millions of votes dont count and never will. I can't remember when a vote i cast has ever effected anything or even come close to it.

[AngryRam]

.is there no end to the turmoil caused by that damned Referendum?

Perhaps, just perhaps this referendum will turn out to be the best thing that has happened in decades.
UK politics needed a shake up and politicians were incapable of doing it. I agree Labour are unelectable and maybe a new party that splits from labour will provide a viable opposition to the government. Turmoil, yes at the moment... Long game though, don't panic..

[Andy_Faber]

Perhaps, just perhaps this referendum will turn out to be the best thing that has happened in decades.
UK politics needed a shake up and politicians were incapable of doing it. I agree Labour are unelectable and maybe a new party that splits from labour will provide a viable opposition to the government. Turmoil, yes at the moment... Long game though, don't panic..

IMO and agreeing with a post further above, I think there will be a new party out of this, and I think it will be called Momentum (the current pro-Corbyn pressure group) who will be very left-leaning, and the Labour party will remain as a left of centre but not way out there party. I think both will get creamed by the Tories and UKIP come what may, given the prevailing mood around at the mo. Just IMO not a political stance

[Gaspode]

I can't see a way for the two sides to be brought back together - if Corbyn wins the election, he will be in pretty much the same position as he is now where he has the support of the grass-roots, but not the PLP (and struggles to fill his shadow cabinet). If he loses the election (and the voting rules they've introduced appear to be firmly trying to make that happen), they'll have a new leader who doesn't have the support of a large number of grass-roots supporters (mostly those who've become supporters in the last 12 months purely because of the Corbyn factor - and a large number of who will already feel disenfranchised because they've been deliberately excluded from the vote). An acrimonious split seems the only way forward.....

[roger_ramjet]

IMO and agreeing with a post further above, I think there will be a new party out of this, and I think it will be called Momentum (the current pro-Corbyn pressure group) who will be very left-leaning, and the Labour party will remain as a left of centre but not way out there party. I think both will get creamed by the Tories and UKIP come what may, given the prevailing mood around at the mo. Just IMO not a political stance

]

And hence an unstable horseshoe parliament with short term coalitions and regular elections....hmmm no thanks

[AdiSalisbury]

sad that there are millions so misguided that they are happy about a decision which will hvae no positive impact on them....doomed we are doomed!

And there is the Remain campaign's problem in one sentence. "You're stupid, now we're doomed". Why can't you respect that others have made a decision that differs from yours without resorting to calling them misguided?

[ramAnag]

IMO and agreeing with a post further above, I think there will be a new party out of this, and I think it will be called Momentum (the current pro-Corbyn pressure group) who will be very left-leaning, and the Labour party will remain as a left of centre but not way out there party. I think both will get creamed by the Tories and UKIP come what may, given the prevailing mood around at the mo. Just IMO not a political stance

Not sure about UKIP Andy...they have about the same number of policies as they do MP's...just one. Personally I detest Farage who, imo, has built a career out of playing on people's fears and paranoias, but I have to grudgingly admit that he touched a nerve with some. Carswell is just a poorly disguised opportunist Tory but apart from those two there is no one at all of any substance. Really they're just a party obsessed with the anti-immigration, anti-EU lobby and nothing else.
Hopefully, out of the current carnage might emerge a sensible and compassionate policy on immigration which prevents the services available to poorer parts of the country being so heavily over subscribed. Once the other parties 'cotton on' to the immigration issue being tackled in a meaningful, respectful and non racist way then hopefully UKIP - the BNP in suits - will simply wither and die.

[Andy_Faber]

Not sure about UKIP Andy...they have...no one at all of any substance. Really they're just a party obsessed with the anti-immigration, anti-EU lobby and nothing else.
Hopefully, out of the current carnage might emerge a sensible and compassionate policy on immigration which prevents the services available to poorer parts of the country being so heavily over subscribed. Once the other parties 'cotton on' to the immigration issue being tackled in a meaningful, respectful and non racist way then hopefully UKIP - the BNP in suits - will simply wither and die.

UKIP have Arron Banks, Mr super-smooth, currently funding them with £millions and with half an eye on upping his profile. Put him on a debating platform with Angela Eagle and he'd turn her into a sparrow.

Re your second point, yes IMO UKIP will die if the electorate see (and this time I think it will need SEE, not TRUST) one of the parties dealing with immigration in a firm but fair manner. I hope one does.

[AngryRam]

IMO and agreeing with a post further above, I think there will be a new party out of this, and I think it will be called Momentum (the current pro-Corbyn pressure group) who will be very left-leaning, and the Labour party will remain as a left of centre but not way out there party. I think both will get creamed by the Tories and UKIP come what may, given the prevailing mood around at the mo. Just IMO not a political stance

The whole UKIP thing is going to be interesting.. If they get a viable leader who has gravitas and is not almost a cartoon figure of fun.. UK politics could get interesting.

[ramAnag]

The whole UKIP thing is going to be interesting.. If they get a viable leader who has gravitas and is not almost a cartoon figure of fun.. UK politics could get interesting.

'Interesting'? Perhaps...but, with Arron Banks' 'agenda' and involvement, possibly a whole lot nastier too.

[AngryRam]

'Interesting'? Perhaps...but, with Arron Banks' 'agenda' and involvement, possibly a whole lot nastier too.

Not saying they will get it right but there is a lot that support some of the ideas but are frightened to say so. If they had credibility then we could see a real dog fight for votes.

[macstheman]

Isn't it strange, the Labour Party taking one if it's regular swings to the left (which usually makes it unelectable) the Tories falling out amongst themselves (and will continue to do so) yet nobody considers the Liberals (are they still a party??) as the party waiting to capitalise and grab the centre ground. No, the talk is of new parties, UKIP cashing in etc etc but never a mention of them poor old Liberals - they must feel real unnecessary.

[ramAnag]

Not saying they will get it right but there is a lot that support some of the ideas but are frightened to say so. If they had credibility then we could see a real dog fight for votes.

Not sure why anyone would be 'frightened' to say things nowadays Angry. 'Political Correctness' is virtually dead and that's ultimately probably for the best imo. There are still things that are just 'wrong' though. For instance, I disagree with the Brexiteers but although I think I'm right and they're wrong I don't know or assume that to be the case and recognise that there's a debate to be had. Same with the issue of 'immigration'. Where racism is concerned however...where people are judging others essentially because of the colour of their skin or their religious background that remains surely wrong. We don't need the 'thought police' to tell us that but neither do we need a political party which has been born out of objection to people of different colours and creeds. Let UKIP stand by all means but hopefully people will soon realise that they are a party based on divisiveness with their roots in a past which no longer exists, and vote (or not) accordingly.

Love to see the Liberals back. Clegg may have been a 'mealy mouthed' so and so but I had a lot of time for some of them (Vince Cable in particular) in the coalition government while the prospect of Boris Johnson as Foreign Secretary fills me with dread.