OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[swaledale]

"Still even you as an accountant (apparently, though I do wonder) must recognise that, 29% of people being from an ethnic background in the broadcast media as against 24% in society is hardly over representation."

As an accountant I can confirm it's a shade over 20% over representation, or, as it were, representation plus VAT.

Not a trivial sum

Ah statistics , its wonderful what you can do with them and of course figures if you quote them and ignore the context. Still I am suitably impressed by AF's ability to accurately assess such matters from casual observation of the media, or maybe he is a closet Mary Whitehouse, but instead of se and violence he watches as many programmes as possible to note down and record the proportion of Caucasian and ethnic minority people appearing.

Marvellous!

[swaledale]

I’ll just repeat, I’ve got under your skin with this. Now Give it a rest

NO as I've told you many times before old man, you aren't even a little prick on my skin, never mind getting under it. I "debate" with you for my amusement, its funny because you have never ever explained why it causes you so much concern, yet you whinged about it in a number of posts.

Thats the issue. But you duck it every time, now why is that old man?

[ramAnag]

Seems to me that some are losing the plot a little as far as this thread is concerned.

Swales’ post (8212) outlines over a dozen points which anyone with a modicum of intelligence should see as warning signs for the state of the UK and Europe today.

What do we get instead...a silly spat about the alleged small over representation of those from ‘ethnic backgrounds’ working in the media.
How about those who are apparently obsessed with the number of darker skinned faces in the media, look at the ‘over representation’ in other, less desirable, working environments.

Thankfully I’m not an accountant so these are strictly ‘guesstimates’...but I’d suggest something in the region of 90% of inner city corner shops are run by, and inner city taxis driven by, people from ‘ethnic backgrounds’...but then they aren’t ‘desirable’ jobs are they?

Likewise, if we look at some of the nicer things in life, when I attend football and rugby grounds or theatres throughout the country then I seem to be in the company of crowds and audiences which are at least 90% white.

Maybe such observations and the fact that there is an over representation of people from ‘ethnic backgrounds’ in lower paid, less secure jobs and poorer housing is more significant than obsessing about a tiny over representation of people from such backgrounds working in the media. Get a grip fellas...your ‘agenda slips’ are showing.

[Geoff Parkstone]

"Swales’ post (8212) outlines over a dozen points which anyone with a modicum of intelligence should see as warning signs for the state of the UK and Europe today."

Why limit the statement to UK and Europe - don't forget USA, Russia, China, Iran etc etc. the whole world is very totalitarian in outlook and the situation has been getting more extreme for at least the last 25 years, if not more. It is as if the current generation of power brokers have outlived the memories of Hitler, Stalin. Mao Tsetung and other early to mid 20th century despots.

What goes around comes around. I'm sure a 1920's version of Swale was bemoaning the development of a new Napoleon from the ashes of the first world war

[Andy_Faber]

What do we get instead...a silly spat

So you say 'don't get into a silly spat' and then you fuel it with ill-informed anecdotes which aren't actually anything to do with the initial comment.

There is actually no spat going on, merely Swale a) having a massive issue with a comment I made quite some time ago and b) not now recalling/accepting that he was proved wrong at the time. To be clear, since I provided independant data supporting my point, I've made no further comment but Swale has repeatedly brought the issue back up (maybe a dozen times), including quoting numbers which are significantly wrong and skewed to his POV, and my personal conclusion from that is that he has some deep issue of his own in this area. If you research back far enough, which you seem to be a fan of, you'll see (as I mentioned) maybe a dozen 'flare ups' from Swale on this, and (my estimate) more text offered by him than offered by me by a factor of maybe 100.

You'll notice I've said 'give it a rest', and although this is an open forum and I'm in essence being 'cancelled' (another wokeism, sorry) from any future discussion on this, I'm happy to do so. End of subject from me from here onwards. I somehow doubt we'll see that across the piece though

[Geoff Parkstone]

"Thankfully I’m not an accountant so these are strictly ‘guesstimates’...but I’d suggest something in the region of 90% of inner city corner shops are run by, and inner city taxis driven by, people from ‘ethnic backgrounds’...but then they aren’t ‘desirable’ jobs are they?"

Firstly, and on behalf of all accountants worldwide, may I say that we too are thankful for that!

Secondly, for someone who has fairness and equality written through him like Blackpool rock, your second comment is unworthy and demeaning. Sure people who run corner shops may not have the gravitas of a teacher, but judging by the couple that I work with, they make a bloody good living - a fair reward for long hours - probably more than they could make as a middle ground professional anything. To traduce such people shows your prejudices more than anything else.

I cannot comment on taxi drivers lifestyles

[ramAnag]

Oh such rancour from the blue corner.

So, point by point...yes GP, you’re right, the rise of the Right/totalitarianism is not confined to the UK and Europe. I was being a tad parochial because we stand a chance of making a difference there, but I’m glad you recognise the validity of Swales’ likening of the situation to the rise of Hitler in the thirties. It seems to upset AF for some reason.

I also recognise your gratitude for me not being an accountant. I feel much the same about you never having been a member of the more ‘caring professions’.

As regards your reaction to my comment on corner shop keepers...your strategy of deliberate misinterpretation is well known and you know full well that I was referring to the fact that the hours worked, the abuse that has to be dealt with and the occasional dangers faced make such jobs unpopular. I have made absolutely no comment about the income generated but the fact is, certain people seem happy for people from ‘ethnic backgrounds’ to do the jobs others don’t want, but then get all prickly when the same section of society start to show ambition and do well in areas that may have once been considered white and more middle class. Personally I barely notice what colour someone is on my TV screen because I’m only interested in what they’re saying.

Andy...I have no desire to get involved in your ‘silly spat’ with Swale. You dislike each other...something you make no secret of...but if you’re going to keep saying daft things like ‘I’m in essence being cancelled’, make ridiculous and provocative comments about ‘wokeism’, threaten Swale with exposure about being ‘proved wrong’ and then run off saying ‘end of subject from me from here onwards’...then you really can’t expect to be taken seriously either as a poster or a moderator.

[Andy_Faber]

Andy...I have no desire to get involved in your ‘silly spat’ with Swale. You dislike each other...something you make no secret of...but if you’re going to keep saying daft things like ‘I’m in essence being cancelled’, make ridiculous and provocative comments about ‘wokeism’, threaten Swale with exposure about being ‘proved wrong’ and then run off saying ‘end of subject from me from here onwards’...then you really can’t expect to be taken seriously either as a poster or a moderator.

I'll repeat what I said, 'end of subject from me from here onwards'. That's me trying to do my bit to get the thread back on track. If you choose to misinterpret that as 'running off' you're way off beam, and that reinforces my view that you have a 'teachers pet' in this and many other disagreements - after all it WAS Swale who took us off track by obsessing on this issue (yet again) out of the blue in post #8213.

[ramAnag]

I'll repeat what I said, 'end of subject from me from here onwards'. That's me trying to do my bit to get the thread back on track. If you choose to misinterpret that as 'running off' you're way off beam, and that reinforces my view that you have a 'teachers pet' in this and many other disagreements - after all it WAS Swale who took us off track by obsessing on this issue (yet again) out of the blue in post #8213.

‘Teachers pet’...lol! You’re being ridiculous...again! We all have people we agree with and disagree with. As it happens I agree with most of what Swale (and MA) write...politically, and disagree with most of what you (and GP) write...again politically. That’s all there is to it.

I repeat...if you say you’re going to do something...do it...don’t come all ‘sound and fury’ and then run away. It was you, and only you, who made a fuss about there being too many non white media presenters, who objected to Swale’s Hitler references and who said you were going to ‘out’ Swale as having admitted he was wrong.

[Andy_Faber]

I repeat...if you say you’re going to do something...do it...don’t come all ‘sound and fury’ and then run away.

To quote one of my teachers, 'Ramanag you have cloth ears'. Swale demanded proof of the issue at hand many months ago, I provided it, he then accepted it (he had to its in the public domain) and has been sore about it ever since, hence his repeated reigniting of the issue. I say AGAIN, 'end of subject from me from here onwards' unless you want me to enlighten you on the source data by PM

[swaledale]

To quote one of my teachers, 'Ramanag you have cloth ears'. Swale demanded proof of the issue at hand many months ago, I provided it, he then accepted it (he had to its in the public domain) and has been sore about it ever since, hence his repeated reigniting of the issue. I say AGAIN, 'end of subject from me from here onwards' unless you want me to enlighten you on the source data by PM

Oh FFS! You are the one with cloth ears!! And an inability to see past the agenda that you were trying to push!
No I bloody didn't accept it! I acknowledged that by coincidence a report indicated that there were a greater percentage of ethnic minorities in the media than there were in the general population.

But this was irrelevant to the question I asked you, which was. Why does it concern you? What made you even think that was the case? and continue to ask you without to date a response - which is what rA means when he says you disappear, or back off, you only address the issue that supports your agenda.

I'm not in any way sore that your apparently racist observation is backed up by the apparent fact there are 4% more ethnic minorities working in the media than are in the general population as a whole. Why would I be, I don't give a ****.

You keep flattering yourself that you have in some way "scored" a point over me, or that you have "got under my skin" ah well little things please little minds I guess, so believe that if you wish I'm really not bothered.

But you still haven't answered why you whinged about this issue in a number of posts? Of course I more than likely know why you haven't done this, because your rather unsavoury views bubble beneath your many posts.

So again, the data is IRRELEVANT, what I was getting at and I've repeated this many times is WHY are you so bothered?

Now if you answered that, we might get somewhere, but you won't because the answer wouldn't be flattering would it?

[swaledale]

‘Teachers pet’...lol! You’re being ridiculous...again! We all have people we agree with and disagree with. As it happens I agree with most of what Swale (and MA) write...politically, and disagree with most of what you (and GP) write...again politically. That’s all there is to it.

I repeat...if you say you’re going to do something...do it...don’t come all ‘sound and fury’ and then run away. It was you, and only you, who made a fuss about there being too many non white media presenters, who objected to Swale’s Hitler references and who said you were going to ‘out’ Swale as having admitted he was wrong.

He is still obsessed with the fact that there is an apparent over representation of non white presenters, he is so thrilled to have had a suspicion confirmed, he is blind to the fact that his obsession with it makes him look more than a little unsavoury in his views!!

Talk about digging a hole, but hey he can't see it and I'm bored with the little man now.

[swaledale]

So you say 'don't get into a silly spat' and then you fuel it with ill-informed anecdotes which aren't actually anything to do with the initial comment.

There is actually no spat going on, merely Swale a) having a massive issue with a comment I made quite some time ago and b) not now recalling/accepting that he was proved wrong at the time. To be clear, since I provided independant data supporting my point, I've made no further comment but Swale has repeatedly brought the issue back up (maybe a dozen times), including quoting numbers which are significantly wrong and skewed to his POV, and my personal conclusion from that is that he has some deep issue of his own in this area. If you research back far enough, which you seem to be a fan of, you'll see (as I mentioned) maybe a dozen 'flare ups' from Swale on this, and (my estimate) more text offered by him than offered by me by a factor of maybe 100.

You'll notice I've said 'give it a rest', and although this is an open forum and I'm in essence being 'cancelled' (another wokeism, sorry) from any future discussion on this, I'm happy to do so. End of subject from me from here onwards. I somehow doubt we'll see that across the piece though

**** me you really are thick or do you just avoid the actual point being made?

[Andy_Faber]

**** me you really are thick or do you just avoid the actual point being made?

By all means put me on ignore Swale, in that same 'special' way you have done TTR which means you can still read all his posts...

[ramAnag]

To quote one of my teachers, 'Ramanag you have cloth ears'. Swale demanded proof of the issue at hand many months ago, I provided it, he then accepted it (he had to its in the public domain) and has been sore about it ever since, hence his repeated reigniting of the issue. I say AGAIN, 'end of subject from me from here onwards' unless you want me to enlighten you on the source data by PM

I suspect none of your teachers ever said ‘Ramanag you have cloth ears’ ...that’s just something you’ve made up isn’t it?
Either way, my ‘cloth ears’, as you call them, are nothing compared to your selective memory.

You make things up when cornered, AF...I’m sorry but there’s no other way of putting it. The ‘spat’ with Swale, which you claim doesn’t exist (8225), is all too real and tedious as regular readers all know. He may wind you up at times but you don’t half go looking for it sometimes. Maybe it’s a strategy to bump up posts...I wouldn’t know.

You said recently you’d got proof that he was wrong and then failed to provide it even when he asked you to. You did the same with me a couple of weeks ago when you said I’d failed to respond three times to your challenges.
I asked what they were and you came up with one particularly lame example but nothing more.

It’s really not very important but I’m afraid it’s what you do. It’s alright to be wrong you know.