OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[swaledale]

I don't see that we will not leave the Eu, but the question remains on what terms? May seems hell bent on pushing through a "hard" Brexit, with no regard to the views of parliament on the deal. Thats ironic, given that regaining control of our sovereign democratically elected parliament was something the Leave campaigners were trumpeting!

There may be a mandate to leave the EU, but there sure as hell has been no vote on what terms and thats going to be the interesting thing over the next few months.

[southernram22]

think we would have not been in this state if the people who haves etc were not seen to be lining their own pockets while the have nots struggle to make ends meet i would have voted to stay if the eu had been transparent and not interfered with everything i like the idea of trade friendship with other euro nations i do not want to see romanian bulgarian beggers sending home our benefits while robbing us bare. i also do not want to see thousands of false immigration walking our streets with many potential terrorists creeping in though that may already have happened the problem is we are a weak nation who cannot sort out its own internal problems beacuse of one thing greed by the powerful rich elite ie phillip green .

[AdiSalisbury]

People are getting too tied up in the immediate politics rather than looking at the bigger picture. The war of words will no doubt continue, but other than some short term stock gains what is it really going to change? Is supply and demand going to catastrophically turn upside down? In real terms, is there any real benefit to the EU putting up a wall? We buy Irish beef because it's good quality and cost effective, if we get stopped by EU politics then it doesn't help either party, Irish go broke because their sales drop, and we have to source our beef somewhere else.

It will work out, stop panicking, there have been no surprises and if anything we've shown strength through an uncertain period of change.

[ramAnag]

Who's panicking? Simply observing. There has been much more bad economic news than good in the four months since the Brexit vote.
Personally I'm sick and tired of hearing 'no one knows what Brexit actually means'. If that's the case, and I think it is, then how the hell did we have an informed debate/referendum about it?
IMO there was a knee-jerk reaction to perceived problems with immigration. Such problems may exist and need addressing, in a responsible and non jingoistic way, but that is something quite different from the bigger economic picture.
Facts remain, only 37% voted for Brexit and the outcome of the vote was never anything more than 'advisory'. Given those circumstances, what has happened with the economy since and the vast majority of economic indicators, is it really sensible to keep repeating 'Brexit means Brexit'...especially when fewer and fewer people seem to actually know what it does really mean?

[AdiSalisbury]

4 months - bloody hell and we say football is fickle! Brexit means leaving the European Union, it doesn't mean building a fence in front of the Channel, ceasing all trade and conversations with the EU and resurrecting the mining industry.

[ramAnag]

Steady Adi...one thing I really can't be accused of is being 'fickle'. If nothing else I've been consistent.
Neither am I saying that four months tells us all we need to know about the consequences of Brexit. It is true though that, in that period, Sterling has gone down, the price of imports has gone up and no one seems clear about what 'Brexit' means.

[ramAnag]

Interesting decision in the High Court this morning.
Maybe the European Court will have to decide.

[Andy_Faber]

I notice Nigel Farage has risen from his crypt

[ramAnag]

I notice Nigel Farage has risen from his crypt

Oh God, has he? Every silver lining has a cloud.

[Andy_Faber]

Oh God, has he? Every silver lining has a cloud.

Seriously, UKIP has just refound its MOJO. every English and Welsh MP will now be bricking themselves, my guess at their thought process will be that if they are seen to be voting against Art 50, enough leavers will jump ship to UKIP at the next election to make it a real risk that they will be unseated - and for that matter that we have a 'very strange' new govt in 2020, or whenever

[ramAnag]

Take your point Andy. My hope is that enough of the original Brexiteers recognise the con and now wish to disassociate themselves from anything to do with Farage/UKIP. Also that sufficient numbers of the Remain campaign manage to put aside their differences and form a moderate centre left alliance that, under the guidance of an effective leader, puts the well being of all the country at the forefront of its aims rather than being governed by knee jerk reaction to far right and not quite so far left ideologies.

A Farage/Johnson/Gove/Fox/Corbyn/Abbott/Banks/Rudd free world would suit me fine...possibly more chance of us winning 5-0 on Saturday...but I did say it was just a hope.

[Andy_Faber]

Take your point Andy. My hope is that enough of the original Brexiteers recognise the con and now wish to disassociate themselves from anything to do with Farage/UKIP. Also that sufficient numbers of the Remain campaign manage to put aside their differences and form a moderate centre left alliance that, under the guidance of an effective leader, puts the well being of all the country at the forefront of its aims rather than being governed by knee jerk reaction to far right and not quite so far left ideologies.

A Farage/Johnson/Gove/Fox/Corbyn/Abbott/Banks/Rudd free world would suit me fine...possibly more chance of us winning 5-0 on Saturday...but I did say it was just a hope.

IMO you are being a bit Utopian, MPs will be bothered about what keeps them in the plague pit for another term. And also IMO UKIP will make one Hell of a noise about this.

You have to ask yourself, do you want Britain out of EU, or Britain in EU and UKIP in government (or at least holding the balance of power)

As usual, I'm not making a political point, just reading the tea leaves

[ramAnag]

IMO you are being a bit Utopian, MPs will be bothered about what keeps them in the plague pit for another term. And also IMO UKIP will make one Hell of a noise about this.

You have to ask yourself, do you want Britain out of EU, or Britain in EU and UKIP in government (or at least holding the balance of power)

As usual, I'm not making a political point, just reading the tea leaves

Joining the 'soothsayers' eh, Andy?
What a horrible dilemma you provide us with. Can't I have the third way...the UK remains in a fairer and less bureaucratic EU and UKIP gets out of the UK...please?
Oh...and Derby winning the playoffs too would be nice.

As you say...'a bit Utopian' but a man can dream.

[FrenchTrimmed]

Joining the 'soothsayers' eh, Andy?
What a horrible dilemma you provide us with. Can't I have the third way...the UK remains in a fairer and less bureaucratic EU and UKIP gets out of the UK...please?
Oh...and Derby winning the playoffs too would be nice.

As you say...'a bit Utopian' but a man can dream.

Like Lots!!!!!!

[swaledale]

Quite how 37% of the electorate is going to elect a UKIP government defies all maths but hey ho!

I do find it ironic that the Brexit camp are now complaining that the democratically elected sovereign parliament will now have the opportunity to debate and vote on Brexit or at least its terms! I seem to recall they were wanting to leave the EU so that the Uk parliament could regain its power to do such a thing!

Its also interesting with the Nissan deal, signs that the government saying "hard" Brexit publicly is not what they are saying privately!