OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[swaledale]

Okay Tricky...I don’t think you’re making a ‘personal dig’ and yes I’m fortunate to live in what many would consider a nice place in rural Derbyshire.
Not sure what that’s got to do with anything. As a matter of fact, between us my wife and I trained for eight years before entering full time employment - always for the State - for about another sixty six or so years, so I reckon we’ve paid our dues and in any case the Derbyshire Dales is solidly pro ‘Leave’ so ironically I find myself as ‘out of step’ around here as I do amongst you, MoP, Adi and the angry man.

Holidays apart, and a likely increase in the cost of living, you’re right...probably the most direct impact that Brexit is likely to have on me is with regard to my son and two grandchildren so that is a concern but, and you may find this odd, I have never been one to just vote for what is best for me. If I had been I’d probably have voted Tory for the last few years...something I’ve never done and never intend to.

As for your comments about housing, social services and education...I believe that Brexit will make our country poorer for the foreseeable future. If that happens how on earth are resources to the three areas you have mentioned going to improve?

With regard to the family comment...I don’t think all Europeans have received unfriendly or discriminatory treatment here since the Referendum but some certainly have and, in the immediate aftermath of the Referendum, I found the behaviour of a minority of Leavers towards people of conspicuously immigrant origin to be utterly objectionable.
That is not really my fear though. The people in the place where my son lives have always been very friendly and the state system very supportive. Should we leave on unfriendly terms though I do wonder how long that situation will last.

Of course Derbyshire dales is pro leave, many of its residents seem to think that we are still in the 1950's! Thankfully I don't reside there any more, it was torture talking to people I'd known for years ( many of whom were educationally at least nominally intelligent), giving their reasons for voting leave, none of which had any basis in fact, but I quickly found that like those who profess faith in a deity, that faith is untroubled by anything which demonstrates it to be at best misguided and at worst just a demonstration of wilful ignorance.

[Trickytreesreds]

Of course Derbyshire dales is pro leave, many of its residents seem to think that we are still in the 1950's! Thankfully I don't reside there any more, it was torture talking to people I'd known for years ( many of whom were educationally at least nominally intelligent), giving their reasons for voting leave, none of which had any basis in fact, but I quickly found that like those who profess faith in a deity, that faith is untroubled by anything which demonstrates it to be at best misguided and at worst just a demonstration of wilful ignorance.

Oh, so now Derbyshire folk are thick/Little Englanders/God squads?

So where did you move to great sage? What part of Europe was worthy of your infinite wisdom?

Still waiting with bated breath as to your "Messiah" to lead us out of this darkness

[AngryRam]

This view can be summed up by this allegory - So if the majority of people in a car vote to drive over the cliff, but then realise that to do means certain death, it would not be "democratic" to review that decision before driving the car over the cliff?

I'm just wondering who those people who voted to leave and will be negatively affected by doing this even with a deal will seek to blame if we leave without a deal?

Do recall that even the high priest of Brexit, Rees-Mogg said that it could take 50 years before the UK recovers from the negative economic effects, whilst another arch Brexiteer David Davis said that "if a democracy cannot change its mind it cease to be a democracy" or James Bartholomew a Brexit Party candidate who said "The people are stupid and generally wrong" and Andrea Loathsome (sorry Leadsom), who said "I don't think the Uk should leave the EU, it would be a disaster for the economy and lead to a decade of economic and political uncertainty".

And who do you think is funding Farage? Do you really think he gives a toss about the ordinary citizens of this country? That he is doing this because he believes in it? A man who has connections to the real right wing elite who stand to make billions from Brexit, none of which will trickle down to you and me or any other poor sucker?

So we’re sitting in the car and the options are driving off a cliff and die quickly or someone setting the car on fire and dying slowly?

What a ridiculous analogy...

[Manofpride]

Hopefully on the 31st of October all this claptrap will be no more, and the peoples vote to leave the EU will
actually happen. Amen!

[Andy_Faber]

You do lighten my day Swale, Ramanag was asking about the cohort of sad English folk who have nothing good to say about their own country, you go one better and bring fire down on your only ally’s home ground

[ramAnag]

You do lighten my day Swale, Ramanag was asking about the cohort of sad English folk who have nothing good to say about their own country, you go one better and bring fire down on your only ally’s home ground

I wasn’t actually.
I was simply responding to Tricky’s question and his misguided view of me living in some sort of bucolic, rural idyll that somehow disqualifies me from having an opinion on Brexit.
I’ll apologise to no one - Tricky or Swale - for having a fondness for the Derbyshire Dales, but it is slightly ironic that Tricky somehow ignores the support shared by some rural areas of the country for the more ‘downtrodden’ he apparently seeks to identify himself with.

Anyway...must go...off to s**g the housekeeper while her youngest is up the chimney and her husband harvests the ten acre field.

[Trickytreesreds]

You do lighten my day Swale, Ramanag was asking about the cohort of sad English folk who have nothing good to say about their own country, you go one better and bring fire down on your only ally’s home ground

He's a gem isn't he?
Perhaps he'd like to help at summer camp this year?




Still waiting for the second coming Swale. Name him/her.

[Trickytreesreds]

I wasn’t actually.
I was simply responding to Tricky’s question and his misguided view of me living in some sort of bucolic, rural idyll that somehow disqualifies me from having an opinion on Brexit.
I’ll apologise to no one - Tricky or Swale - for having a fondness for the Derbyshire Dales, but it is slightly ironic that Tricky somehow ignores the support shared by some rural areas of the country for the more ‘downtrodden’ he apparently seeks to identify himself with.

Anyway...must go...off to s**g the housekeeper while her youngest is up the chimney and her husband harvests the ten acre field.

Woah, I never said you was disqualified from having an opinion.

My point around where you live was to highlight who the staunch remainers/ leavers are.
Those that feel down trodden by the effects of membership, tend to be low end income areas,
Those with money(I'm on about the Linekers/Geldofs/Bransons) of the world have no idea why.
As for your area as pretty as it is. I believe it's about self preservation. One the reasons Swale pissed off to who knows where.
You need to ask yourself why the main remain areas swim around London and Scotland.

[ramAnag]

Woah, I never said you was disqualified from having an opinion.

My point around where you live was to highlight who the staunch remainers/ leavers are.
Those that feel down trodden by the effects of membership, tend to be low end income areas,
Those with money(I'm on about the Linekers/Geldofs/Bransons) of the world have no idea why.
As for your area as pretty as it is. I believe it's about self preservation. One the reasons Swale pissed off to who knows where.
You need to ask yourself why the main remain areas swim around London and Scotland.

Tricky, you repeatedly bang on about where I live...even though you’ve no idea where...and you told me to ‘look down the ladder socially’ to be in touch with those that want to ‘Leave’.

Where am I looking down from btw...my much vaunted position as a retired teacher?

Now you’re going on about Lineker and Branson being out of touch. Seems to me anyone who disagrees with you is ‘not worthy’ or ‘has no idea why’. Personally I’d be more inclined to take notice of the likes of Lineker and especially Branson than you and the rest of team Brexit constantly whinging on about this ‘assault on democracy’.

[Andy_Faber]

I wasn’t actually.
I was simply responding to Tricky’s question and his misguided view of me living in some sort of bucolic, rural idyll that somehow disqualifies me from having an opinion on Brexit.
I’ll apologise to no one - Tricky or Swale - for having a fondness for the Derbyshire Dales, but it is slightly ironic that Tricky somehow ignores the support shared by some rural areas of the country for the more ‘downtrodden’ he apparently seeks to identify himself with.

Anyway...must go...off to s**g the housekeeper while her youngest is up the chimney and her husband harvests the ten acre field.

Sorry I wasn't very clear, I was referring to a discussion from a few days ago where Aldi and I identified the issue of English folk hating England in a way other nations in the union never do. Actually some Americans are the same, I've seen some terrible stuff on the net today. Enjoy your s**gging. Or did you miss a * out?

[swaledale]

So we’re sitting in the car and the options are driving off a cliff and die quickly or someone setting the car on fire and dying slowly?

What a ridiculous analogy...

Suits the ridiculous notion of voting for something that will negatively affect the country and oneself and yet refusing to acknowledge this I'd say.

[swaledale]

Woah, I never said you was disqualified from having an opinion.

My point around where you live was to highlight who the staunch remainers/ leavers are.
Those that feel down trodden by the effects of membership, tend to be low end income areas,
Those with money(I'm on about the Linekers/Geldofs/Bransons) of the world have no idea why.
As for your area as pretty as it is. I believe it's about self preservation. One the reasons Swale pissed off to who knows where.
You need to ask yourself why the main remain areas swim around London and Scotland.

Actually wrong - given that this whole charade was kicked off by middle to upper income members of the conservative party who have believe that we still have an empire, are a mighty world power and if we aren't its all the fault of the EU! None of those are remotely interested in the so called downtrodden and lower income people - remember who it was that shafted the miners (even if there was a touch of self inflicted wounds there) - other than a touch of social patronising so that they can ensure that they have the necessary worker drones to do the **** jobs they wouldn't touch.

And even if you argue that isn't the case the main players in the Brexiteer cause are certainly not downtrodden lower income people, they are rich members of a right wing establishment elite, who control much of the economy and the majority of the press and they wont be affected by Brexit, but you and those on here who so gleefully support it will and in spades!

[Trickytreesreds]

Actually wrong - given that this whole charade was kicked off by middle to upper income members of the conservative party who have believe that we still have an empire, are a mighty world power and if we aren't its all the fault of the EU! None of those are remotely interested in the so called downtrodden and lower income people - remember who it was that shafted the miners (even if there was a touch of self inflicted wounds there) - other than a touch of social patronising so that they can ensure that they have the necessary worker drones to do the **** jobs they wouldn't touch.

And even if you argue that isn't the case the main players in the Brexiteer cause are certainly not downtrodden lower income people, they are rich members of a right wing establishment elite, who control much of the economy and the majority of the press and they wont be affected by Brexit, but you and those on here who so gleefully support it will and in spades!

As an ex miner, I find that analogy interesting.
Considering Labour shut more pits than anyone.
Also, with the countries current climate policies, what are your opinions now on miners?
Perhaps, just perhaps. This had been on the horizon for ages.
It's obvious you hate the Tories. Believe or not, I'm no fan myself. In fact I hate them all.
But you still refuse to answer my question don't you?

C'mon. Come out the closet. You think Corbyn is the Messiah don't you?
Des[ite the fact he's a complete prick, I'm amazed at the fawning over that clown.

So come on Swale, either say you piece or just shut yer gob. You're getting embarrassing now.

[AngryRam]

Hopefully on the 31st of October all this claptrap will be no more, and the peoples vote to leave the EU will
actually happen. Amen!

As an ex miner, I find that analogy interesting.
Considering Labour shut more pits than anyone.
Also, with the countries current climate policies, what are your opinions now on miners?
Perhaps, just perhaps. This had been on the horizon for ages.
It's obvious you hate the Tories. Believe or not, I'm no fan myself. In fact I hate them all.
But you still refuse to answer my question don't you?

C'mon. Come out the closet. You think Corbyn is the Messiah don't you?
Des[ite the fact he's a complete prick, I'm amazed at the fawning over that clown.

So come on Swale, either say you piece or just shut yer gob. You're getting embarrassing now.

Corbyn just received the lowest ever poll rating didn’t he.. 18% against the most useless government this country has had in decades.. It really is a head shake why the guy is still leading the Labour Party. They should be a complete shoe in in the current times but he is totally Unelectable..

[ramAnag]

Corbyn just received the lowest ever poll rating didn’t he.. 18% against the most useless government this country has had in decades.. It really is a head shake why the guy is still leading the Labour Party. They should be a complete shoe in in the current times but he is totally Unelectable..

Inclined to agree about Corbyn, decent enough bloke imo...lousy leader, but try telling Theresa May that.
What were the results in 2017?
You remember that election we were never going to have...think May lost thirteen seats while Corbyn’s Labour Party gained thirty in the only ‘election’ of late where the electorate hasn’t been been confined to membership of the Conservative Party.
Greatest pity was that all it led to was a hung Parliament and a Government totally dependent upon Arlene Foster’s fundamentalists.

Not sure why Tricky keeps trying to tell us all that Swale wants Corbyn as the next PM. Not got much to do with Brexit and I don’t remember Swale showing any great signs of being a Corbynista.

Surely after the disastrous ‘leadership’ provided by Cameron and May the question of which of the two incompetents - Johnson or Hunt - will be the next to take the poisoned chalice is the more important question.