O/T:- ⚠️Impressed with the leadership [The UK Party Politics Thread]

[BanjoPie]

Can’t help thinking that if all the people who were actually at the party at No 10 just stepped forwards and admitted it and that they had made a a huge mistake and apologised with some sincerity, we could then just move on from this debacle. If government staff involved were just honest, perhaps there would be no need for resignations but just lessons to be learnt.

Am I asking too much of these people to be honest?

[BigFatPie]

Worry not. When you live in the one of the the most class-ridden, class-divided countries in the world, ‘the establishment’ is a pretty straightforward term. It is that nexus of privately-educated individuals and families that have access to vast amounts of inherited wealth… who just so happen to rule the roost over our politics, major corporations and business, judiciary, media, civil service….in fact any institution that’s part of the exercising of power in this country.

One such school, Eton, has provided 2 of the last 3 Prime Ministers. Begad! That’s more than from Ellis Guildford, William Sharpe, Bulwell Academy, the ex-William Crane and Player Comprehensives put together!!! Hats off to Eton, what an achievement

As it’s an accurate term, it’s also a very dangerous one. So rest assured that The Establishment itself – Pfeffel, Trump, Farage etc. and their friends in the media – will do everything they can to obscure its meaning, strip it of meaning and confuse the people as to what the establishment actually is. But some people still know what it means.

I wouldn’t disagree with any of that. It’s just that it’s so nebulous people use the term to suit whatever agenda they have, highlighted of course by Farage and co during the referendum campaign.

Starmer’s detractors apply the term to him, probably accurately, but that doesn’t mean he wouldn’t make a good PM.

[sidders]

Make no mistake, Bozo's future is entirely dependent on next Thursday's by-election. Losing a seat that has a 23,000 majority would signal his end and the bookies today make the Lib Dems slight favourites.
And to add to the mess, the PARTY has been fined for not declaring funding for alterations to Downing Street. Happy days! Except that the favourite to succeed him is tank operator Truss.

[Elite_Pie]

Make no mistake, Bozo's future is entirely dependent on next Thursday's by-election. Losing a seat that has a 23,000 majority would signal his end and the bookies today make the Lib Dems slight favourites.

I hope Labour supporters look at the bigger picture and decide to vote tactically. Their candidate has zero chance of winning, so giving their vote to the Lib Dems would almost certainly see the Tories booted out.

[Mapperleypie]

We all deserve so much better than Johnson as our PM.

We are all being asked and have been asked to make big sacrifices due to Covid and it’s crucial we have trust in the people making the rules, which includes, more than anything, them following the rules they have set themselves.

Johnson is done.

[the_anticlough]

Make no mistake, Bozo's future is entirely dependent on next Thursday's by-election. Losing a seat that has a 23,000 majority would signal his end

I hope there is no mistake here but we have to remember Pfeffel has set new highs in shamelessness and lows in accountability. Just look at Patel, the most glaring breach of the ministerial code and she's still in situ. Only the 22 committee and cabinet could oust him and while they think that, despite everything, he may still be an election winner in 2024 they won't move against him.
Johnson was a careful watcher of Trump and he likes to think we live in Trump's post-truth world where black is white, and white is black. Lie and deny everything is still his mantra.

Add to all this, for capitalism to continue to reign supreme and rip up what's left of the planet you need to undermine right and wrong as much as possible and weaken the state and people's expectation of what the state can do - Johnson is the perfect 'leader' to achieve those things. Just like the Republicans with Trump, you can't look to the tories to get rid of him, so how is it going to happen?

[KintoreMagpie]

Eventually got round to watching the BBC interview I had recorded from July of Mr D Cummings. No love lost with Boris and, somewhat chillingly, DC indicated that following his departure from government he would be working in the background to try and undermine things for the PM and his wife.

Did find myself agreeing with him that the current cosy production chain of supplying people at the top, in both politics and the civil service, has to change to offer a better chance for future generations of UK citizens to try and deal with the world’s many problems.

[Elite_Pie]

Just like the Republicans with Trump, you can't look to the tories to get rid of him, so how is it going to happen?

Not so sure on that, because the recent polls will lead to some very squeaky bums on the Tory back benches, and the rank and file MPs won't take kindly to their position being under threat. When that happened years ago they had no hesitation in telling Thatcher that it was time to go, I don't why it should be any different with this clown.

[ncfcog]

As Kenny Everett used to say, "Round 'em all up, stick 'em on an island, and bomb the *******s!".

[the_anticlough]

Not so sure on that, because the recent polls will lead to some very squeaky bums on the Tory back benches, and the rank and file MPs won't take kindly to their position being under threat. When that happened years ago they had no hesitation in telling Thatcher that it was time to go, I don't why it should be any different with this clown.

Seems a bit too much wishful thinking on the last few pages of this thread - or what should happen, Tories take right v wrong out of the equation.
Agree that's the way all their leaders go, but it's always about election prospects rather than conduct - any misdemeanour will just be lied, denied and delayed out of existence.

Would a bye-election defeat move the needle? I doubt it. Him getting his comeuppance would be great, but we're in the 12th year of this tory government and face it being a full decade and a half whoever they inflict on the country next.

[nw6pie]

Seems a bit too much wishful thinking on the last few pages of this thread - or what should happen, Tories take right v wrong out of the equation.
Agree that's the way all their leaders go, but it's always about election prospects rather than conduct - any misdemeanour will just be lied, denied and delayed out of existence.

Would a bye-election defeat move the needle? I doubt it. Him getting his comeuppance would be great, but we're in the 12th year of this tory government and face it being a full decade and a half whoever they inflict on the country next.

The only way the Tories will go is if Labour and the Lib Dems (and maybe the Greens with younger voters) wise up and stop contesting seats where one of them is clearly the strongest "opposition" - so Labour mainly in the north and Midlands, and the Lib Dems further south in rural areas. Then they can team up with the SNP and Plaid Cymru, and at least try to have a coalition of the non-right-wing and save the NHS, railways, water, etc.

Maybe one day we'll also move into the 21st century and embrace some form of proportional representation so that every vote really counts.

As for Boris Johnson, I think it will take more than one by-election defeat for the Tories to decide to send him on a permanent vacation to Pepper Pig World.

[Elite_Pie]

Maybe one day we'll also move into the 21st century and embrace some form of proportional representation so that every vote really counts.

Must admit I've never been much of a fan of PR and coalition governments, but the way this bunch of crooks have abused their big majority has made me change my mind. To me it seems the best (or in truth least worst) option next time round.

As for Boris Johnson, I think it will take more than one by-election defeat for the Tories to decide to send him on a permanent vacation to Pepper Pig World.

Is Pepper Pig the spicy version? When the fat liar was telling everyone how wonderful Peppa Pig World was, I would have loved to take him on in a Peppa Pig quiz. Due to having grandchildren, I know the names of all Peppa's family, friends, even her schoolteacher! A week or so ago when all this 'non-Christmas party' stuff emerged I had a bet on 2020 being the year that Boris leaves No. 10 at 25/1. The odds are now down to 10/1 at best, not sure whether to cash out with a modest profit or let it run. I'll probably wait until the result of the North Shropshire by-election before deciding.

[forwardmagpie]

Must admit I've never been much of a fan of PR and coalition governments, but the way this bunch of crooks have abused their big majority has made me change my mind. To me it seems the best (or in truth least worst) option next time round.



Is Pepper Pig the spicy version? When the fat liar was telling everyone how wonderful Peppa Pig World was, I would have loved to take him on in a Peppa Pig quiz. Due to having grandchildren, I know the names of all Peppa's family, friends, even her schoolteacher! A week or so ago when all this 'non-Christmas party' stuff emerged I had a bet on 2020 being the year that Boris leaves No. 10 at 25/1. The odds are now down to 10/1 at best, not sure whether to cash out with a modest profit or let it run. I'll probably wait until the result of the North Shropshire by-election before deciding.

If you bet on 2020 Elite then a fool and his money will soon be parted !

[Elite_Pie]

If you bet on 2020 Elite then a fool and his money will soon be parted !

I take it you're not a betting man. I could make an instant 'cashout' profit now because the odds have tumbled since I placed the bet.
Betting is all about value, and I thought 25/1 was generous.

A question for you - if a General Election was held tomorrow, would you vote Conservative?

[JoePass]

Must admit I've never been much of a fan of PR and coalition governments, but the way this bunch of crooks have abused their big majority has made me change my mind. To me it seems the best (or in truth least worst) option next time round.



Is Pepper Pig the spicy version? When the fat liar was telling everyone how wonderful Peppa Pig World was, I would have loved to take him on in a Peppa Pig quiz. Due to having grandchildren, I know the names of all Peppa's family, friends, even her schoolteacher! A week or so ago when all this 'non-Christmas party' stuff emerged I had a bet on 2020 being the year that Boris leaves No. 10 at 25/1. The odds are now down to 10/1 at best, not sure whether to cash out with a modest profit or let it run. I'll probably wait until the result of the North Shropshire by-election before deciding.

Just get used to being on the losing side with Sir Kneeler of Rotherham. And remember, set in stone Milibland was 12 points ahead… no one, I mean no one, when it comes down to it will vote for pathetic Labour, only you and your stupid deranged mates.